Sex therapy with Dr. Esan Graja Doggi

Hello, I'm Julianne Good, and this is Psych 101. We're here to make psychology understandable, entertaining, enlightening, and informative with tips for creating a healthier state of mind for you, your family, and your friends. So today we're going to be focusing on sex and sex therapy. My guest is Dr. Esan Graja Doggi. He is a clinical psychologist who received his doctorate degree from Argosy University in Southern California. He is presently the clinical director of NARU's clinic in Irvine, California, and teaches at Argosy University in Orange. And the Chicago School of Professional Psychology in Irvine. He has been named a distinguished professor for his outstanding contribution to student learning and serves on the board of advisors in the Master's in Counseling Psychology program at Argosy University. Dr. Esan is trilingual in Persian, German, and English, multiracial, and multiethnic, and has lived, studied, and worked in numerous countries. He has worked with at-risk youths. He has worked with on probation and in high schools, HIV-affected populations, substance and sex addiction clients, trauma and domestic violence clients, and couples suffering from emotional and sexual problems. He is an existential therapist who specifically enjoys couples and family therapy. Welcome, Dr. Graja Doggi. How are you? Doing great. Thank you very much, Julianne. I would like to start off our discussion. Right now with asking you with all of your years of experience, what are the most common sexual issues couples present with to you? Well, sure. That is a very interesting question. I'm sure everybody wants to know about that. And I would say that we have to really differentiate between the most common sexual issues for women and for men. Because each one of them. And I think that the most common sexual issue for women is the one that really presents differently. As we know, we are equipped with different organs as well as a different brain and simply neuro-biological body. So you may actually get different results or different answers from therapist to therapist who work with people on sexual and emotional problems. I don't know that On the side of women, we usually have an orgasmia, that would be lack of orgasm, and dyspareunia, which is pain during intercourse. And on top of that, a certain discordance or discrepancy between sex and intimacy with their intimate partners. And I can explain much more about that, but before going there, let me just also list what's happening for men, which is quite different. And for men, usually what troubles them is erectile dysfunction. And what we mean by that is more or less a lack of ability to either get aroused or to remain aroused. And second, arousal. Either, Martin Delis, would be early ejaculation. It used to be called premature ejaculation, but that's kind of an outdated, almost derogatory term that we no longer use. So we go with early ejaculation. And lastly, you may be surprised, but also something that's not necessarily organ-related or function-related, but mostly intimacy and emotionality-related, is lupus. And that's a lack of partner cooperation or understanding of male sexual cycle and sexual response. Okay, so can you go into that a little bit more? Would performance anxiety go along with that whole explanation that you just gave us? Sure, absolutely. That comes up a lot in terms of, well, that's a very good question, the performance anxiety, which is directed... Performance anxiety is linked to the erectile dysfunction, as well as early ejaculation. Performance anxiety, you see, when we go into this sexual cycle, which is a stage-by-stage process of a person first getting excited and then kind of progressing to a more excited level of the whole body responding to the situation, which we call arousal. And that's at a time when... And that's at a time when our body becomes ready. Our organs actually have to, you know, change form and shape and kind of get... And become available for a certain type of activity, which we know as more or less intercourse. Now, as you're aware, intercourse is not the only form of having sex or enjoying sex. There are multiple different sexual activities, but generally, the body... The body is getting ready for intercourse. Now, as the body is getting ready and the arousal is getting to a level where this readiness is shown and exhibited and the two partners are willing to engage with each other, we enter that stage of performance. Now, this actually also is a misnomer because, really, the word performance generally, psychologically, socially puts pressure on a couple or even an individual, whereas sexuality should be something that should be really... It should be in a state of relaxation and enjoying and pleasure rather than feeling pressure. However, because it has been socially ingrained in our behavior to somehow deliver on some kind of a promise or somehow deliver on some kind of an expectation, there is... There is... some kind of an anxiety or worries or agitation associated with it. And a lot of times that is unconscious. Or if it is not completely unconscious, it's there, but we don't pay attention to. And that can cause problems because, as you know, when we worry about an issue and an outcome, then we act differently. We think differently and we feel and behave differently. And we know that males specifically, or men in general, have a particular issue with that. The anatomy of the male body is quite different than the female body, where males have to really be in a very relaxed state of mood and presence in order to actually get more aroused. However, when they start to worry about, delivering on an expectation, which is triggered by the word of, you know, or label of, even expectation of performance, then they start acting differently. They kind of tense up. They kind of, they can't focus on, and I'm using this word very loosely, focus, but they can't really be present on enjoying the presence of their partner and their engagement. And that type of worrying and anxiety is directly linked to those issues that I mentioned earlier, erectile dysfunction, which usually we see in terms of lack of ability to get an erection, or even maintain that erection for the time period that needs to be. Or also, sometimes it leads to early ejaculation. So basically, too much anxiety leads a male to kind of withdraw from that sexual act, which is exemplified by seeing that, you know, he's simply ejaculating too early. And what we mean by that is even before, not just the partner, but the person himself is satisfied with the act. So it sounds like there's a lot of pressure on the male end of the whole, the other way around, and sometimes both of them have almost complementary problems that kind of tie into each other and create that particular sexual-emotional knot that now they call a problem. And a lot of times, as you can imagine, a relationship is a combination of two people contributing to that particular dynamic that we see and we call a relationship or intimacy. So it's not just one person's problem. It is two people coming together with those particular understanding of sexuality, education, readiness, even biological readiness, how their bodies are reacting and interacting with each other. And then they suddenly create that type of problem that is unique to them. So not every couple really comes in with performance anxiety issues. They could come in with something as benign as, let's say, we haven't slept with each other for a while, and things used to be okay, but we don't know what's going on right now. When we are talking about sexual problems, it could mean that we are not in a relationship with each other. And so we have to rely on a spectrum of different stages of sexual intimacy, even before sexual intimacy occurs, and even after what has occurred. So I would not really sum everything under one category and say, you know, usually couples have problems with performance anxiety or even just performance itself. To give you an example, a lot of times, what we see is the performance problems or intercourse problems that they have experienced over time have now turned into a lack of desire. So one problem that started in one stage of the relationship has now been transferred to another stage, which is a much earlier stage of a sexual relationship, the level of desire. And then you see couples come again. They're still together or married or in a relationship, and they have been for a while, but for a very long time, they report they have not even felt desirous of each other or wanting to engage in some kind of a sexual activity with one another. So that's how you see it can be quite complex. Yes, I would imagine, especially if... And from what you have been... I'm just saying it sounds like the original issue was never resolved, and it may have been stemmed from miscommunication in the first place, so that it ends up transforming into sexual difficulties and then lack of desire. And am I correct? Absolutely. And I like the fact that you mentioned this notion of miscommunication. And miscommunication... Miscommunication in what I believe what is happening, and I have been working for a few years with many couples, and my complete understanding of human sexuality is that miscommunication is actually built in, in our nature, meaning it's not something that occurs after the honeymoon or after a few years, but it's actually... Its seeds are planted. It's planted in our very existence, from early on in our identities as sexual beings. We also know this phenomenon in more technical terms as sexual dimorphism. And what we mean by that is that men and women actually completely experience the world, their world of sexuality completely differently. And when we compare them to each other. Now, that experience, a completely different experience, distinctly different experience, is so deeply rooted that the miscommunication is actually bound to happen. We have to really expect that. Now, interestingly, when couples come together during the dating phase and in the mating phase, they're very forgiving. They are not as straightforward and honest, if you will, as they would like to be. And that's understandable because there is a lot of risk involved. We fear we don't want to lose someone that we are highly interested in and invested in and really kind of wooing to our side. So, based on that, there is this tolerance that builds. I mean, the beginning of a relationship... There is a relationship that mediates and reduces chances for miscommunication. But if we really slow down a little bit and really look at what is happening and what is not happening, we can easily detect sources for kind of miscommunication brewing over time. And that's how we see that after a while, because people have missed that opportunity of actually honestly getting to know each other. Learning about one another. Learning about uniqueness of each other's bodies, psyche, personality, likes and dislikes. Then they have set up a particular scenario for themselves that over time becomes more rigid and more difficult to deal with on their own, given their level of tolerance. And their level of tolerance changes. During time, after the honeymoon and after responsibilities pop up, after people move in together, after people start having children or financial issues or in-law issues appear then their initial level of tolerance and likability for each other cannot really support them well enough. And that is when they start realizing that something is not working and but by that time they have dug themselves too much into the into that particular trench so they can't get out of it and then hopefully they would kind of look at it and say yes we are stuck and we need to go to a therapist and not really ignore the problem furthermore right and then for couples who are at that point of being stuck you know at the initial stages of this could you recommend like maybe one or two things that that people can do to start opening up that communication and that talking about sex because it seems to me that in this society we're we have this dichotomy about thinking about sex it's either you know on the spectrum of being dirty to being this beautiful you know pie in the sky almost experience so you know I think people just in general have a really difficult time talking about sex it's getting that conversation going and sitting down with with your partner and saying hey I think we're having problems with with our sex lives let's talk about this where it's not intimidating or forceful or anything like that what would one or two tips would can you recommend yes absolutely what we see what problem is that we we have a lot of people who are not really interested in sex and we generally have simply grown up associating sex and sexual activity with you know not only beyond those terms that you mentioned the dichotomy between a dirty activity and some something so wonderful wonders and beautiful to experience and but also deeper than that we have associated sex and sexuality with a lot of embarrassment shame guilt sin TV, in papers and magazines and so forth. There are all kinds of stories being told. And again, those are indirect imaginations, if you will, of sex and sexuality that either glorify or demean sexual activity. Instead of actually directly coming to talk about sexual experience as a natural human experience. Just as much as, let's say, we sit down and talk about a type of food or dieting or nutrition. Because we have come to accept nutrition as a part of normal daily activity and a necessity for human beings. And we don't associate that no longer with basically taboo terms or concepts. So my suggestion, going back to what your question was. In terms of how can we help people really kind of break down this taboo or difficulty, rigidness around sex and sexuality. Is that we start staying away from these misconceptions about sexuality. And more or less myths. Which can extend to the realm of talking about people who are perfect, more or less, in their sexual activity. Or miserable, more or less. And really understand that just as much as diet and nutrition or even looks of a person can be very diverse. And can range anywhere on a scale from, let's say, from 1 to 100. Anywhere on that scale. So is sex and sexual activity. So we have to really come to accept it first. That people are diverse in their sexual experience. But there is no one norm. That people will... People have to adhere to. But sexuality is just like any type of preference that people have in dressing themselves up for the day. It depends what they feel like. One day, like today, when it was a little bit rainy. They may feel like they want to have less or more clothes on. And whatever it may be for that person. And the second part of acceptance becomes actually direct acceptance. And the third part is actually direct conversation. Direct talk about what sexuality is. And what it can create for a person in terms of their reality, their personality, their expectations, their preferences. Now, it's easier said than done. Because we have to really first assess with whom we can have these types of conversations and discussions. But we can say... We can say... We can say... We can certainly have that type of discussion and conversation with a therapist. If not with people that we can trust. To change the whole society and our friends' and families' discussions around this will take eons. But the first thing we can do is if we see that there is something we don't like in our relationship. We can take that initial step of accepting that, okay, there is something different. There is something different in place. I feel differently than my partner. My partner has different desires and wishes and level or ability. And I have a different set of those expectations. Now, we have a... The problem is that we have a discrepancy here. One goes into one direction and another into another direction. So now we need the help of a professional. To go and seek and talk to someone who is knowledgeable. Someone who is knowledgeable about this. Has been trained in these fashions and can actually dissect it. And assess the situation from a neutral perspective. And put everything back into perspective. What has been going on for a while? Where did we go wrong? Kind of veer away from each other. And how can we get back on track? Right. And you know, how... As a therapist, would you start to work with a couple... Of opening up sexual issues? And getting them to just be comfortable with you? Because you had mentioned before the shame and the guilt. And any past history. If they've had any kind of abuse situations. It can be rather difficult in just unwinding all of that history. And getting them to a point of being comfortable. With just having that conversation. And just... Sure. Just having the language. Because I think a lot of people just don't have the language. Some people find it very difficult to say any type of sexual language. So, what do you do with a couple that is in that situation? Yeah, that's not really easy to do. And I hope that the couple has already taken the step coming in. Which actually changes the whole picture. Because, you see... My first worry is really about those couples that don't do anything about this. They do not even call. Or take a step toward changing the situation. Because there's absolutely nothing we can do on that end. But once a person... Even not the whole... Both, you know, people... Both members of the couple. But just even one of them decides to call in and say... Well, you know, I need to talk to someone. There's something going on here. So, the way I personally go about this is a little bit different than a typical couple therapist. Or a typical sex therapist. What I do and how I have been trained is a combined type of a training. I have been trained as a couples and sex therapist. So, I have been actually trained to incorporate both aspects of this particular complex. So, I have a very specific complexity of a relationship in my practice. So, when I'm working with my couples... On the one hand, I do pay attention to their emotional health and relationship. And on the other hand, I also keep in mind that I also need to assess as well as help if possible or if necessary in the realm of sexuality. So, it's never out of my mind or out of my sight. Both of these components go hand in hand for me personally. Unfortunately, that's not the case in the field with a lot of couple therapists who have not been trained or educated in the sexuality part of sex therapy. And I'm not talking about just human sexuality. Every therapist, every psychologist, every psychotherapist has taken a course on human sexuality. But that's one thing. And the other thing is that being able to actually do sex therapy has usually traditionally over the past, I would say, 30, 40, 50 years been reserved to a completely segregated and different group of therapists which have been called sex therapists per se. And that's it. That's how they have identified themselves. And the public too more or less has followed that type of distinction. They have sought sex therapists only when they had sexual problems or when they were referred by their own couple therapist who could no longer really work on sexual issues to this sex specialist to help with the couple with particular sexual problems only and no emotional problems. And then you have the other camp where we have a lot of couple therapists and psychologists who work on relationships and couples and families and such. Who specifically just focus on the emotional aspect of the relationship or other aspects that are not sex related such as, let's say, financial aspect, child rearing, parenting, in-laws, other type of relationship problems. So for me, because I have been trained, there is more or less a protocol that I follow. That I have. And I have come to understand helps a couple specifically when they come in. And that's, first of all, there's a part of an assessment that we usually do anyhow when we see a couple whether they have proclaimed they have a sexual problem or not. We simply focus on a more holistic type of an assessment. So I take into account a series of history or historical points that they bring up. Whether or not they are close. Right. Whether or not they are intimate. They spend time together with each other. They are happy with each other or not. And at any of these points of the clinical interviewing or the assessment, clinical assessment that I do in the initial phase, there could be good indications for me and to a trained eye that there may be more to the case than meets the eye. So that would be a kind of a marker for me to just look at. And I would like to just simply hone in and go more deeper and ask specific questions. I really like what you mentioned about comfort. When you say that people have to feel comfortable. And that is something that we know as rapport building. We just do that automatically. Therapists do that automatically. However, you know, I kind of, because of my training, I can easily expand that rapport building into sexual functioning of a couple. And I think that's really what distinguishes a person who has been trained in both couple and sex therapy from another therapist who has not been trained in this combined fashion. And which is my own level of comfort. I, as a couple sex specialist, am comfortable myself talking about sexuality, talking about human nature, talking about human sexual orientation. Right. And talking about human sexual nature. And things are just simple for me because of my experience and training and clinical experience. So based on that, I think the level of comfort is simply something that is natural and follows. And clients, my clients at least, pick up on that very quickly. That it is okay to talk about sex. It's okay to bring up something that may not be in my mind. It's okay to bring up something that is in my favor. Or even if it is in favor or not favor, at least pleasant or unpleasant. Right. But something that needs to be talked about. And I think when they feel that the therapist, I as a therapist, am comfortable with going there, they easily follow. Exactly. And I don't think that every therapist is comfortable about talking about sex directly. They may go, like you stated before, they go around that particular issue and they hit up other problems that the couple may be facing. That yes, they may directly or indirectly be affecting the couple's intimate life. But it's wonderful that you're that comfortable and outright with the process. Right. Because I'm sure that kind of gives them permission. And it models for them that, you know what, hey, if he can talk about sex that comfortably, maybe I can start to learn that process also. Because it is a learning process. We are not trained or schooled in this society to be talking about these issues. And this is one of the reasons why we're bringing this kind of information to the public. So I do want to take a brief time to say that if you want to download this program, we are on iTunes. All you have to do is type in Psych1on1, that's P-S-Y-C-H, the number one, O-N, and another number one. And we're also on Stitcher, Twitter, and Facebook. And if you would like to call in and ask Dr. G any questions, we're here to help. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. If you have any questions or make any comments or give your opinion, we'd really love to hear from you. The number is 800-893-9562. Again, that's 800-893-9562. So Dr. G, I would like to ask you, how did you get into doing couples and sex therapy? Because it's not a common specialty. It's a specialty, I think, out there. So can you tell us a little bit about that? Absolutely. Actually, this was, the couples and sex therapy was a simple, natural outgrowth, really, out of something else that I had started, which was couple therapy. And I really was very interested in doing couple therapy when I was going through my clinical training. And I really liked couple therapy as compared to other peers that I had going through the training. And they really did not enjoy working with couples, and mostly because of all these kinds of interactions that were going on between them. And because they can just flare up into some kind of a fiasco. But I was really interested in this dynamic that was going on between two people, rather than just working with one person and one person's partner. And I really liked couple therapy. I liked the more I came across all kinds of modalities and treatments and so forth, I noticed that this distinction actually exists in the society, and it didn't make sense to me, for me personally. In fact, at one point of time, when I was finished with my schooling, I thought, wow, you know, I have become a therapist, I have become a psychologist, I can do assessments and testing and treatment with couples and families and individuals, that's no problem. However, I feel like I should go and get another type of a training, maybe sex therapy training, in order to further my skills. And that is when I came across that particular type of a training that was actually combining both couple therapy and sex therapy at the same time. And I was just kind of fell in love with it. I said, wow, I was telling myself this is the best thing that can happen to a therapist, and I really need to learn that. And that was a year and a half training. So I took that, and there was a lot of material to go through, weekly seminars and supervision and reviews of cases and all kinds of material and research to go through on both ends, on couple issues in terms of issues. So I was able to go through the emotional aspects of relationship as well as sexual aspects of the relationship. So, and then once I was done with my training, I noticed how useful and beneficial and effective this training was for myself. However, there were some components still missing for me because I saw that even this training was not as effective as I wished it had been, and it was just missing certain components. For instance, a huge component was the biological perspective of the stages of development that people go through in terms of age differences, and specifically that sexual dimorphism that I mentioned earlier, which is that completely different worldviews and experience that men and women have compared to each other. So what I did is because I was at the same time also teaching at Augusta University, I put together a training. I put together a course, and I delved more into it and added to my curriculum and those elements that were missing. And then I was teaching it. I taught it a few times, and I saw that also in my students that they were making strides in their therapy with their clients as well. So it just made sense, and I decided that this would be my specialty. And I basically went further with applying that new model to my clients. And in fact, today I have created an organization, an association for that, because it just is a model that works really well, and there's a big response and demand for it as well. I have a lot of peers and also current students and just simply colleagues who are therapists or psychologists, and these two see that missing component. And they kind of attest to the fact that we need this. This is necessary. We have to educate ourselves. And it's an exciting part of my career. Right. And I think they just don't teach that component of at least a master's program for sexuality. It's kind of skimmed over because there's so much in the curriculum that they have to teach. It's kind of like, well, okay. Well, you know, from the state of California, we have to teach a course for 12 weeks, and that's all you get. So, you know, it's just kind of getting at the surface. So I appreciate that you're doing the teaching and getting more information out there, because that's what we need is more information to be able to take care of this really, it's a fascinating problem, but it's, I think a lot of people, is a part, there's sometimes it's just as important as eating and breathing and everything else because it's one of the most pleasurable parts of being a human, period. Absolutely. And I think, you know, sometimes we can actually compare that to two other concepts of human phenomenology. I usually do that for myself to kind of grasp the complexity of it. I see that, you know, finances, for instance, also are very particularly meticulous and kind of deep concepts that not everybody can agree upon. But interestingly, we don't have this dimorphism in the concept of my finances, meaning a dollar means a dollar to everybody. Everybody can get that concept. Everybody easily can buy into it and understand addition and subtraction and formula that would predict something, for instance, a mortgage rate and whatnot. Same thing with religion. You have all kinds of different religions all around the world, but they have a commonality to themselves. They have a structure and philosophy that is very similar to one another. So if one person can understand one religion, they can understand another religion, although they may disagree with it, but they understand the philosophy behind it. However, with sexuality, we do not. Right. The particular problem with sexuality is that sexual dimorphism, which is specifically distinct ways of experiencing sex. And as a result, everything else that we are experiencing in this world, including, as you mentioned, pain or other things that are kind of underlying that pain, which is like disappointments or expectations or belief systems and needs. human needs that are associated with it are completely different at times at war with each other and at times at complete overlap with each other, but then the interpretations of individuals differ as to what makes what sense and kind of meaning that they derive from it. And therefore, people usually end up with two different experiences from the same event. And interestingly, it is so complex that they're not even really willing to understand this event from another person's perspective because it's just overwhelming enough for one person from their own perspective. So we have this particular complexity, and that's why I'm very glad that finally in our field, we have moved beyond. Beyond that superficiality of learning, let's say, about human sexuality in an elective course. In fact, as recent as 2011 or 2010, I believe, human sexuality was not even a required course for passing the licensure for therapists and psychologists. That's unbelievable. It has only been recently added as a required. It has always been an elective. It has always been on the sidelines, and people were interested, took it. But only recently, as I believe, if I'm not mistaken, 2010, but it might have been 2009. I'm not sure. But within the last three, four years, it has become a required component before even a person can pass the licensing exam and practice as a therapist. And we're glad that it is happening, but we have to do even more. As you mentioned, we have to move beyond just taking a course. Now, that's what I'm so excited about. Yes. And we have to move beyond just taking a course. We have to move beyond just taking a course. And we have to move beyond just taking a course. And bring couple and sex therapy into a very uniform type of modality that we can use and help our clients. Yes, it needs to happen more often. We need to get the conversations going and, again, to get couples to that comfort level where they can start opening up and saying, you know what, this is what I need, and my needs are changing. Everything else in life changes. And so, why not? Sexual needs and desires. Especially as you get older, the hormones change. And, you know, we all go through changes. And so, you know, if a couple is together long enough, I think they need to realize, hey, you know, I don't like being touched that way anymore. That kind of feels weird now. Or, you know, just start getting comfortable with opening up and discussing, and these situations. And it's okay to sit there and say, you know what, this might sound selfish, but I would really like you to do this or that to me tonight, you know. And be comfortable with it and have the other partner say, okay, great, let's change things up here. Exactly. I'm sure we will get there. I don't have any qualms about it. We will get there. You know, as you know, humans are creatures of habit. Yes. So, I'm not in a habit. We have this reactivity. We usually function according to this mode of reactivity. We react to situations rather than in a preventive measure. So, I think, as you mentioned, you know, this discussion of sexuality and the discourse that we need to have should actually start very early on, not even later. But, you know, puberty, the concept of puberty has been there for millennia. Both male and female go through puberty. But do parents regularly usually put it on their schedule to have these types of discussions with their children? No. Because that's really that inception of sexuality. And I would say even go further all the way to birth. We know that even infants can, you know, differ in terms of their sexual experience because this is a genetic component. This has a very much neurobiological aspect. of it that go all the way down to, you know, the time that you're born and even earlier than that, because that is how it has been created. However, if we can have at least a capacity of understanding and tolerance toward these different styles of experiencing the world as a human, as a sexual human being, then we can become more preventive or not just preventing something, I mean, preventing the worst really from happening, but more proactive, I would say, rather than reactive. Then we can become proactive in our approach toward human sexuality. And then as a result, then have people really, as you mentioned earlier, react and respond to each other's sexual needs from a much more accepting and, you know, welcoming way. And, but then, there's a lot of work that needs to be done as it stands today. And that's where we are here, you know, as sex or couple and sex therapists trying to do that work. And hopefully they look at the work as being play. Hey, let's have fun. You know, let's just, you know, let's feel wonderful together. That would be a great thing to do is just have that openness and, you know, put the time into it. And not feel the pressure, the expectations, as you mentioned before. And if they're there, talk about the anxiety, just get the conversation going. And if you can't get it going, yes, then go find a sex therapist. If that's where you think that the seat of the problem has started, go get couples therapy if you think that the communication has broken down. And again, because of the, wonderful world of the internet now, people can go and do their own research. They can call up and talk to the therapist, interview him or her a little bit, and see if you can, you know, if you could gel. And there's just so much information out there now that, that be a wise consumer, but go get the necessary help when you need it. Because, So I'm going to give the, we have a few minutes left here. I'm going to give the callers another opportunity to call in and ask Dr. G any questions. The number is 800-893-9562. Please give us a call or let us know that you're out there, okay? That would be great. I, you know, with social media getting into the picture now, how has this changed our dating and our intimacy behaviors? I think the social media definitely has helped bring up these hidden aspects of our social sexuality and sexual experience that has been kind of ignored. And I think that's what we've been doing for a very long time. To give you an example, I think a prime example for that is this notion of or phenomenon known as sexting, where people are texting each other with sexual information in windows, requests, pictures, words, and whatnot. And we see that is such a prevalent issue and we call it problems when it comes to certainly teenagers or minors and so forth who are, who may actually be sexually abused. Be Jobs pulls more or less. So we have that burgeoning now in our field with the social media and Facebook and the different gadgets that people carry with one another. And that shows really how much of almost unprocessed, unresolved, sometimes repressed, sometimes simply, you know, kind of ignored aspects of human functioning we are dealing with. Meaning people want to express themselves, they're just looking for a more acceptable, almost politically correct or socially acceptable means and vehicle to do that. But such vehicles have not really been created yet to the extent that we wish they were, where there is both safety and communication and freedom of speech and respect and boundaries and sensitivity, you know, and acceptance and so forth. We don't have that type of vehicle yet. But social media have been very successful at highlighting the need for that, as well as providing some kind of a reprieve for people to vent what they couldn't do in regularly, you know, traditional media. That's very interesting. I've never heard it phrased that way. So thank you for that explanation. And who knows what the outcome is going to be of that later on. For, you know, especially people who are in their teens, 20s and 30s right now, who, that's a real prevalent way of communicating right now. So that's going to be interesting to see what happens with those generations and what kind of intimacy problems comes come out of that. And hopefully it's going to be less, but who knows? I, you know, we can only, we can't predict at this point. So, and talking about social media, I just want to say, you know, like to wrap this up and what quick tip can you give people if they are having sex problems if they're having sex problems i would say the first thing is accept the fact that people are different and it's okay to feel different and okay to have such problems and just like any other discomfort that a person has and secondly i would say seek the help of a therapist of a specialist and also very much proclaim your discomfort when you're talking to them and contacting them be straightforward from the very beginning there's something uncomfortable i want to ask you and you know it's not easy for me but you know there's something that i would like to talk to you about and also on top of that maybe even research your contact the therapist that you want to talk to you and see if they have been trained or educated if they're specializing in human sex and sexuality and couple relationships and you can even be very straightforward with your questions from the very beginning in terms of training you know ask your therapist you know first and foremost i would like to know if you have been trained in this field and secondly this is uncomfortable for me what would you suggest i have some questions how do i go about it and then hopefully you know you'll find the right therapist and i'll see you in the next video therapist through that conversation can be very anonymous because when you call in they don't know their name or anything it's just very comfortable at first but then if you find the right therapist based on that discussion and conversation everything else should follow smoothly after that because therapists usually are trained to establish rapport establish trust and help me help make a client comfortable that's great advice thank you so much if you would like to contact us at www.therapist.com we'll be happy to help you contact Dr. Eson Grajadoggi directly his phone number is 949-510-1321 or his email address is at info info at g-e-t-d-r-g.com i would like to thank you so much Dr. Grajadoggi for being with us it's very enlightening and wonderful wonderful topic so thank you so much for having me i appreciate that thank you and this is julianne good thank you so much for joining me on psych one-on-one take care of yourself and take care and i'd like to give a special thanks to jeremy and nick for keeping free speech alive at skid row studios stay tuned for the kumran report thank you you you both both both Thank you.