Sluts R Us — societal definitions, slut-shaming, and sexual double standards

Hi, good evening. Good evening. Oh, you can hear me good. I can hear you. How are you, my darling? I'm good, how are you? You're losing things already. I'm losing things already. I know. It's so hot in here, though. I might lose my shirt this time. I know, I know. So there's something to wait for, to hope for. Hi, everybody. This is Sex and Dippity. I'm Dr. Limor Blockman and... I'm Luanne Hernandez. How are you? How is everything? Everything is fabulous. I had a wonderful afternoon delight. You just, yeah, you mentioned it right before we started. So could you repeat that? Afternoon delight? Yes. No, but what does it entail? Oh, you know, you start, you're like, just 15 minutes of cuddling. But wait, let me take off my clothes because I want to feel your skin against mine. Two and a half hours later. You're losing time. I know, it's like, oh my God, I got to get going. Luckily, you put your clothes back on and ran out. It's true. I know. That's exactly what happened. I know. I was like, oh my God, my hair. Let me tame this. Let me tame this beast. Well, we're going to talk. I really hope that our listeners, that they're really well lubed because we're going to mind fuck the shit out of them tonight. I mean, it's going to be heavy stuff. Really. Really. So you want to present the topic? Okay. So I got the idea for this topic about 10 years ago. Really? And I will tell you why. Because I had a friend of mine, a dear friend of mine who was expressing her sexuality and discovering it. Yes. 10 years ago. And she said to me, how many people do you have to sleep with to be a slut? Okay. Does it count? Right. Does it count? Does it count? And so Luann. And so I was like, okay, I'm going to sleep with a young Luann. Young Luann. Thinking like already very like into my like very comfortable with my sexuality, having a very healthy like attitude towards sexuality. Yeah. I said, it's not about a number. What is it about? What did you tell her? I said, it's not. I was like, I don't think being a slut is about how many people you sleep with at all. I said, it's about how you feel about yourself after and how you feel in general about sexing. Sex and sexuality. Okay. So the topic is. Well, we're titled Sluts R Us. So we're going to talk about sluts. Damn straight. Okay. So really, the question is that the way society sees it, what does it take to be a slut? Honestly, I want to give you a funny anecdote that has to do with George Bernard Shaw. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. colorful writer that he attended this dinner party at one point and he leans over he was very entertaining and and inappropriate in a nice manner and so he leans over to the woman sitting to his right and he tells her uh madam would you consider sleeping with me for a hundred thousand pounds the woman kind of you know fluttering around eventually says you know i just might okay a few minutes pass by and he leans over again in his wonderful magnificent way and tells her madam would you sleep with me for five pounds he tells him i would certainly not what do you think i am he tells her well madam we've kind of established what you are now we're just negotiating the price all right so that's basically um what we're starting off with because the idea um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um um! um I think what I just, you know, it's interesting because when I was in college, we had this class and we were talking about all sorts of topics. It was Philip Zimbardo's like, this is my class if I got to create everything I wanted to do in one class. Right. So we got I know it was great. And one of the classes was on sexuality. And we had a high end escort come in. And, you know, it's interesting because a woman, a female high end escort turned madam turned like porn star. The whole aspect of sexuality was covered. Right. And her expression of it, of the way she described the escort business and what she got into and how she liked it. It didn't seem to me to be slutty at all. Yes. And so that's why I'm kind of like interest. Like it's it's. To me, it's not even about the exchange of money. Like being a slut isn't about the exchange of money. It's just a term that we use to in my in my opinion, it's a term we use to shame women for expressing their sexuality in a way that they feel comfortable. Again, like I don't I don't believe in using that term in general. I think it's very I think it's oppressive to women. OK. And I think it's it's not OK. You know, we go. I mean, I use it as a term of endearment for my dear friends. Oh, you're a slut. I was like, oh, you slut. Yeah. Oh, you slut bag. You know, but I mean, in reality, like we use it as a way to to kind of put women down for expressing their sexuality in a healthy way that. OK. OK. I fully agree. And honestly, the aspect or the question about whether we use that term in relation to sexuality at all is going to be analyzed heavily throughout the show. But I want to start with the dictionary. I mean, I don't want to start with the dictionary definition of a slut. Let's do it. Because I really I want to kind of vomit. So we start with a promiscuous woman, a prostitute, a sassy girl, minx, a bimbo, hoochie floozy, whore hussy, a woman who has many casual sexual partners and wonton, a woman with low standards of cleanliness. My vagina is squeaky clean and sentient rosy. So that means that I would never be caught. I don't think so. I mean, and let me go on. I want to I want to. I love to hear this because so far it sounds like somebody who's a lot of fun. Oh, a lot of fun. Cleanliness. Yes. But let me just add to it that initially this term was made. You know, it's it's first first debut in approximately 1450. And back then it was related to kitchen maid or a drudge, something of that sort. And. I want to I want you to listen to this in the 19th century. The word was related to as a euphemism for a female dog for a bitch. So I want to say something. Pavlov's bitch here would like to say that let me just run around naked and be exploited by hung men that give me their flashy bone. You know, with all the other fallen women out there. Fuck you very much for giving me the permission to do this. And, you know, so this is the dictionary definition of it, which is very vast. I mean, it has nothing. It has to do with sexuality, but other terms had to do with a bitch had to do with like a specific, you know, something that has to be characteristic to something or a kitchen maid. I don't know what it has to fucking do with that. But for instance, it really didn't have to specifically do with the sex. It had to do with the sexuality of it. Some of it had to do with the cleanliness. Some of the some of it had to do with other features that have to relate to women. And I find it just very confusing in terms of. Who is a slut? What is a slut? What does it mean to be a slut? And who starts relating to women as sluts? Do we do this as women? Do we expect it from men to call us sluts? Who really relates to women as sluts? I mean, it's a big question and I'm going to get to it. But let me hear what you think. I mean, is that something derogatory that women use against women or? Well, I mean. I find a lot of women use it towards women in my like experience. They call they use it as a way to. Put down other women who are maybe more comfortable expressing their sexuality, maybe having sex with someone that they wish that they were having sex with is basically a reflection. That's a good motivation. No, exactly. It seems to be a reflection of a woman's insecurity with her own sexuality when she starts slut shaming or. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Another woman by calling her a slut. When a man uses it, I feel even more disgusted. So you think that a man calling a woman a slut is by far more painful than a woman calling a woman a slut? I think it depends on the man. And I think in the relation to the woman. If it's a man calling a woman that he's had sexual intercourse with or been intimate with in any way, if he calls her a slut, I think that's disgusting. So just the factor that is making the difference is whether he had sex with a woman or not. Okay. I understand. Yeah. Because I think that's extremely disrespectful. Number one. Number two, I think, you know, I'm like in order of horribleness of human beings. You know. I put a man who. This goes first. Yes. Okay. Then a woman calling another woman a slut because, you know, so long as you continue to oppress women, you're still oppressing yourself. And then if you're a woman and then men calling her a slut, like it's just disgusting. I agree. I agree. I fully agree. And but I feel from my own experience and empirically a little different about it because I do feel and we're going to go into the whole sexual double sex. Okay. In the whole sexual double standard. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. In the whole thing. was the main thing that women used against women. I mean, that was the main, main thing, the main derogatory wording that women used. I mean, it wasn't anything, it was specifically that, nothing else. Men didn't have anything similar to that. And so... They have player. They have, oh yeah. They have pimp daddy. Oh yeah, yeah, dog. You gotta go into that and analyze what do men have etymology wise and comparing to women, there's not much. But for instance, another very famous book, The Scarlet Letter, which I'm sure you're familiar with, Hawthorne's book is very significant in terms of, and this depicts for someone that haven't, you know, read it. I'm sure everybody's familiar with it. At least Hollywood. At least the one with Demi Moore. Yeah, okay. The Hollywood version. She looks so sexy in the shower. Okay. So yeah. So the thing is, no, but honestly, the book is very highly recommended, but it deals with the 18th century's hypocrisy towards, you know, having a child out of wedlock and the woman is being bashed and shamed over having a child out of marriage. But the thing is, and I really want to... I think I have... I'm going to put here a quotation from the movie, from the book, from the book rather. I don't think it was in the movie at all. But the women in the book actually want, actually wish for the heroine's death. And a bunch of them say, and I quote, they say, if the hussy stood up for judgment before us, would she come off with such a sentence, such a lenient sentence? At the very least, they should have... They should have put a hot iron on her forehead. And basically, they're really hoping for her death. Yeah. So the shaming of this whole situation was by far worse by women. I mean, women were so bad and so intense about their emotions towards a woman that broke the boundaries of what was accepted socially that I find it just... Disgusting. Disgusting and just unheard of. I mean, there's nothing like it, in my opinion. Yeah. And let me go back to more... Something that is more contemporary. And I want to bring you an example of an interesting book by someone named Jessica Valenti. The book... The title of the book is actually very interesting. It's called He's a Stud, She's a Slut. And that basically just tells you what it's all about. And the idea, and Valenti talks about the whole idea in the book, is that if you have a vagina, you've been called a slut sometime in your life. It doesn't have to do with what you did or not. And she depicts the whole story of her being in, I believe, elementary school and being called a slut by one of the other girls. And... Basically... You really don't have to do much. Anything that you would do can title you a slut. Except for, let's just say, I don't know, praying or sitting without any motion. Unless, you know, unless any motion might be deemed, you know, whorish. And you can do, I don't know, maybe praying or knitting. You know, it would suffice to not call... Unless you do nude knitting. Right. And then you are a slut. Because that... That would say you're a slut. That would cause... Yeah, so... So... No, it's interesting because you don't even actually have to engage in the action. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Just the insinuation that could have happened. And somebody could say, you know, a man can say, oh, that's what I saw. You know, I was working with these girls at my old high school. They go to... I went to Catholic school for 12 years. Wow. Yeah. Wow. So, in spite of that, I still have a healthy view of sexuality. That is remarkable. Yes. But I work with the girls, too. And I was working with these... These girls this past year on this idea of creating, you know, talking about this topic with young women also. And what I told them was... Because they were talking about, like, yeah, and then these girls were trying to talk, like, shit about this other girl. Because they heard that she slept with this guy and that guy and this guy. And I was like, the only people that actually really know whether or not she slept with whoever, like, three different people, are her and those three different people. I was like, and really... You never know. I was like, unless you're peeping, Tom, like, doing that weird shit. I was like... And then, who's the real pervert there? That was my thing. I was like... And so, I was talking to them. And I'm like, you know, it's not about that girl. It's about... I was like, as women, you need to be supportive of each other. I was like, that's, like, all about women's solidarity. Like, you know, when you say that about her, you're basically saying... I was like, or those other girls. Because they were like... They were like... They were like... Oh, no, we're not like that. We're not like those crazy, you know, freakish people that are like, she's a whore. She's a slut. Yeah. Because they were very actually forward-thinking 15, 16-year-old girls. And I was like, whoa, where did y'all get that from? Because when I was 14, 15, 16, I was like, that stuff was, like, totally... I mean, I was still very, like, forward-thinking for my age. But I was not as forward-thinking as these girls are. They are amazing. Well, it's very different today. You know, the generation is by far more advanced. Yeah. And so, I was like, you know... You can't... You don't know what was going on. Using those terms, slut, whore, skank, was like, hoe, whatever they are. Yeah, anything. Anything is basically the same. Yeah, it's just... It's a way to shame a woman for expressing her sexuality. And I said, and really, at the end of the day, what's wrong with that? And is it for expressing her sexuality? That's the question. Even if you just talk to a guy. Like, I'm like, that's the whole thing. It's like... And that's part of, like, you know, being a young woman, learning to have relationships with men and women. That's just part of it. Yeah. And it doesn't matter. And it's sick, too, because it goes into work. You know, like, it's awkward if you go into a boss's, like, a male boss's office to have a talk with him alone with a closed door. Yeah. Because... Or if you start having a mentorship. Because this whole slut shaming, this whole, like, she must be sleeping with him to get ahead. Right. All of that comes into play also. And it's just... It's sick. Like, it's a sick part of our culture. And it reflects the... The insecurity that women... That I think some women have with their own sexuality. Right. Because where else does it come from? I mean, it's also our society telling us that women are in two camps. You're either a whore or you're a virgin. Yeah. We're going to talk about the Madonna whore at Academy. Or mother. We have three. Oh, really? Because I think that the Madonna is the mother. I mean, kind of... Yeah. I mean... I mean, if you're saying Madonna, then yes. Yeah. You're either virginal and a saint. Or you're a whore and you're easy and you sleep around and whatever. But what I find and so disturbing is that it really doesn't have to do, at least at an early age, it doesn't have to do with sexuality. I mean, you can be called a slut even before you had sex. You can be called a slut when you're like 10. And you're like, I haven't even reached menarche. Right. Yeah. What's going on? It hasn't come. Where is it? What is a penis? What does that look like? I mean, these drawings do not do a good job depicting what a penis looks like. By the way, family planning in Catholic school, that did not prepare me at all for what sex was like. What a shocking surprise. I was all, that penis is like this. Is that what they're related to? It's like this. It's like that. I'm like, that is not what a penis looks like when you're about to engage in intercourse. I would hope not. Intercourse. Well, I'm still using the terms. I'm still using the terms. Well, they screwed me up still. I'm like, intercourse and penis. A dick that looks like this is not ready to go. No, no, no. It's not ready to go. Yeah. And I think they encourage you to look for that penis that looks like that. So you'll be kind of, you know, reserved. And I'll talk about that whole thing, which is, I kind of thought that we were in a different era. But, you know, in antiquity, whores, whores. Or prostitutes were called meritrix. It was like kind of a naming. And they were, you know, they were allowed to engage in all sorts of activities. They weren't allowed to testify in court or specific things. Whoa. That you cannot do. Whoa. You can't go to a court of law. No, no, no, no. Not with that ankle bracelet. But seriously, I mean, they were like divided from other from, you know, like respect. They were like respectable women because they were wearing like a yellow kind of toga. They're like, whoa. We need to make sure we know who you are. This is really disturbing, that yellow thing you're wearing. But in general, I find that, you know, and a lot of theorists assume that there is some sort of a sexual fantasy of being a hooker, being a whore for women. Yes. What do you think? I think that's absolutely like. So pole dancing. Pole dancing is another fun activity. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I do pole dancing and I love it. And it's I think for women, it's one of the few. I think the whole reason that the hooker and prostitute thing. Yes. And stripper and all of that thing is so empowering for women is because it's one of the areas where they're able to have and express their sexuality in an unbridled fashion. You know, and I feel like in our society, we can't do that. Like, it doesn't matter. It's almost like it doesn't matter what society. You're in. Yeah. It's always your genitals are seen as a drawback, like your penis, like your vagina. I mean, I'm sorry. You're hopefully. I don't know. Your booze and your pussy are seen as like a liability. I mean, even with health insurance at times. You know what I mean? Like, I agree. You know, it's it's seen as a liability. And here, you know, and I go to pole dancing Saturday mornings. It is the one area with so much camaraderie and just so much. Affection and like general interest in each other and supportiveness for us expressing our sexuality. OK. That I've ever been in. And, you know, you can go to however many of these like, you know, women like empowerment groups and, you know, feminists, whatever. I was like, but I've never felt more like supported by other women as I do in this class. Really? Like everyone's super like cheering you on as you're trying to take on these things. Like. Like cat calls towards each other, like trying to be, you know, like, no, that's great. Like, do like you've got it. Like, that's a great, you know, my instructor Autumn today or on Saturday was like, Luann, I love like that song you chose. Yeah. Like it was some like very like. So you choose your music. You can choose your own music. Like we all have the opportunity to choose our music. And she's like, wow, that was a good. She's all you're really coming into like like finding which one niches. Is your niche each time. And, you know, you're all cat calling, taking your clothes off for each other. And it's a great sexy opportunity for you to just be like, hey. This is me. This is my sexuality. And then. I'm so happy to be here with other women expressing that because in the world we can't do that. Women are calling each other whores and sluts and like that is hurting each other. That is very true. You know that that in the. Scientific world, they really examined it because this is the main. This is a very big phenomenon. The whole pole dancing fitness thing that has been going on for, I believe, two decades or some sort of. Yeah, about two. About two. They have they have competitions, which I I hope to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I'll cheer you on my love. But I'll definitely. The thing is, it was examined, you know, a few studies actually questioned two sides of it. One. Questioned the whole idea of students. They were stripping for, you know, financial support or other aspects of the situation. And the studies actually examined how did they feel as strippers and students? Did they that the idea of them being both affected them? Did it help? Did it hinder? So you're saying. Aspects. Strippers and like women in the classes who are actually strippers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. classes I'll get to the classes but women that are strippers and that you know that that's one side of their persona they are students in general not students of pole dancing students oh like college yeah college students okay and that's how they support their education and but nobody knows that they're stripping for money people so but they're not the people in their classes right no nobody knows in their close range you know family and friends and how do they deal with it that was the question of the few studies that I've actually reviewed and all of them came to the conclusion that for these women having the aspect of being a student was actually something that really helped them not only with clients which was entertaining yeah they actually presented it as as as like an edge that they they used as something positive but it gave them something to kind of lean on as they were you know buffering the whole idea of being a stripper because the women themselves felt kind of bad about it I mean and I'll get to the students of you know the pole dancing students that are just fitness you know women that are just looking for something to do as a fitness method but in terms of being really a stripper women themselves found it you know kind of uncomfortable to deal with it and the fact that they were students college students actually gave them something to lean on something to hold on to and kind of you know they they found it as something that they can lean on and and not you know use that because that's part of their persona being a student was something that they can present 14 14 14 kind of go together. I mean, a lot of people think of a stripper as a hooker. And, you know... A lot of strippers do engage in prostitution. It's very true. And we'll talk about the whole prostitution, even though I believe that we should have a whole show about prostitution. Oh, we should, yes. Because it's a really big, big, big topic. Yeah. Maybe we should hold off on that one. Maybe we should try to find a high-end escort. Anybody know a body worker? Oh, yeah. A sex worker. Please contact us. Yes, but the studies that actually dealt with pole dancing students, just women that were interested in the fitness part of it, they found that in these classes, women felt a little insecure. And this is really in contrary to what you are saying. You know, the feeling in your class is by far more kind of, you know, gathering and good. But these women, tended to put like a definition as to what is slutty and what is sexy. And to them, being sexy was related to being secure and self-confident and everything. And sluttiness had to do and get this, with the way you move. Yeah. And you're promiscuous. I mean, for God's sake, as we said, don't move because, anything might be deemed horrid. I'm like, is that a slutty move? I just opened my legs. What else are you fucking doing on a pole? Sorry. I have a giant metal pole in between my legs. That sounds really good. Yeah. It actually is, except for all the bruises. You know, you get them in any way. Exactly. I'm like, you know, whatever. Whatever you do, you get them. You know what? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm like, how can you do your fitness in bed or on a pole? You get them. You get it somewhere. Moves are slutty. So, what the fuck else are you doing? This is exactly, you know, that's what's surprising that these women still found it very needed to put these definitions on the thing. I mean, on what is sexy, what is slutty. I'm not slutty because I'm not doing this. And they even mentioned, and I found it interesting, that the instructor kept telling them to be gracious. Be gracious? Be gracious. Be kind. Be nice. Don't be slutty. Don't be slutty. I didn't realize that you could be, I feel like sluts are gracious. Me too. Very welcoming. I agree. They are very gracious. You know, I feel like it depends. I think that's interesting because, you know, one of the things I have to say about the studio that I go to, the Pole Garage, is that the instructor and the person who created it, Drea, she is a very comfortable, she's very comfortable with her sexuality. She doesn't use terms like slutty. When we use raunchy, we're like, it's called the raunchy sit. So you sit with your legs open. Like, it's a raunchy thing. Like, we're like, and that's okay. So you have like terms for things? Yeah, and we're like, but that's okay. Like, sometimes you want to be a little raunchy. Sometimes you want to be a little like, more like, what we call polarina. Like, like graceful. Oh, I like that. Polarina. And like, you know, whatever. And sometimes you want to be just the dirty, raunchy, like pole dance. And you know what? That's okay. And I feel like that the attitude of Drea and the instructors there is that the expanse of your sexuality is okay in the studio. And I think that's why it's so, the women have that camaraderie. But I'm not sure that that goes on in all studios. Yeah, as I said, I don't think so because, you know, studies do show that women have some sort of, you know, an ambivalent view of this, of this activity, which I find kind of sad. Because if you're gonna entertain something like that, which is really, I think it's marvelous. I love it. I would, I would, I think other than the fact that it's really good. Cardio and everything. Yeah, it's really, really good. Oh my God, it's so flippin' hot in here. I know. Take it off. Take it all off. I know. I should have worn another shirt. I know. It's getting hot in here. It's getting hot in here. It's getting hot in here. It's getting hot in here. But really, so, so here's the thing. And we're gonna go back to the whole Madonna whore, the economy, and the whole thing. Yeah, let's see that. But the male fantasy, I mean, I wanna talk about it. So, the male fantasy. Is it the male fantasy or the female fantasy? About being a whore? I think it's, I think it's both. Well, yeah, two different things. So, for women, being a, being a, thinking of being a slut or a whore or a prostitute, prostitute per se, I mean, getting, or a stripper. Put them all in together. Yeah, the whole thing. Basically, anybody besides, you know, what people think is appropriate soccer moms. Yeah, soccer moms. I think soccer moms are fucking sexy sometimes. they're amazing. Yeah, not bashing soccer moms. I'm just saying. Just saying. They should be. I think they should be like a strip club for like, soccer moms. I think they, I think they're like quite a few. That's like a concept. There's, there are quite a few soccer moms in my pole dancing class. Really? Yes. Wow. I love it. Yeah. I have to tell you, the best lap dance I got in my lap dance workshop was from a soccer mom. Wow. She, I mean. That's really reassuring. Yes. So it means like it doesn't end there. I don't think it ever has to. That's the whole thing. I think that you're constantly rediscovering it. Bring it on. Right, right. But, the thing is, so there are two sides to it. One, that empirically, it is seductive. It is suggested that women have this fantasy of being a hooker or a prostitute. In general, being paid for to engage in any sexual activity because subconsciously, it kind of gives you the opportunity to abandon yourself in a relationship and not worry about getting attached, which women tend to do. What do you think? I also just think it would be nice to have someone pay for my pussy. Like, it's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing. That is very true. It's like, how much is it worth today? That is very true. Give me the money. Leave it on the glass. I don't know how much you think. I was like, I want to know how much you think it's worth. I know. I'm like, get the fuck out of here. I'm like, oh no. That fantasy just went out the window. I got too complicated. Oh, it's too complicated. I don't know. In the cleanup. Okay. But the thing is really, let's go back to it. Abandoning your yourself in a relationship and not worrying about getting attached or feeling bad about casual sex. This kind of thing. What do you think? I mean, is that, does that make sense? That women would feel like the role play of being maybe a prostitute or not even a role play that kind of a fantasy to actually really go into a room with a client that you don't know that you don't know which is the factor of the stranger which is the factor that, you know, women relate to very well as a fantasy and then being paid for it as something, you know, and I'm going to quote one of the new movement feminists that I really kind of appreciate, Anne McClintock. She said that, and I'm going back to the whole prostitution per se, even though we're going to really have a whole show about that. But she said that society is really obsessed about women being prostitutes and making it illegal just because a woman in this position is actually asking and getting more than a man, you know, in any white collar, you know, society and, you know, any function and then she's expecting this money for her services and actually for something that men expect for free. Men expect sex for free? They don't? No. What do you mean? That they expect sex for free? That a woman... From women? They expect to have sex for free? That's from a prostitute, from a woman. From a woman that's not a prostitute. Right. Don't men expect sex for free? Isn't that what dinners are? It's still free. Dinner doesn't pay for sex. I'm sorry. No, I'm just joking. But, you know, I heard some assholes say that. Some piece of shit say something like that. Yeah, so that's why, yeah, but don't you think it's true? I think it's absolutely true. I think that society condemns women for being prostitutes and, you know, we can discuss the whole thing about how in the United States it's illegal everywhere and in Europe and in various places and all over the globe there are many, many places that prostitution is legal and legitimized. But the thing is, really, does that make sense? I think it's absolutely true that men expect women to have sex just as a casual thing because they expect it. And then they're upset that women ask and get this kind of rape. Money. They're like, hey, I need a little bit more than that. Yeah. Well, do I think that it's wrong or do I think that it exists? Do I think it's... I think, what do you think? Do you think that that makes sense? Why is the bashing? Why, you know, men relate to women as a slut if she's expecting something? Why is she expecting something in return? Men relate to women as a slut if they expect something in return. I don't know that it's the men that relate to women that way. I think they're kind of like, just don't tell anybody. I think the women... Okay. I think the women really feel bad about it because, you know, it's this idea that we have that our sexuality is priceless and you can't put a price on it. But apparently, you can. Who thinks that? I think women think that. You can't put a price on their sexuality and their ability to engage in gender. The agency of sex for money is something to me, I see it, as so global in any various aspect of it. And let me, let me detail. Whether you are, here it is, someone's little sugar thing. Okay. He's your sugar daddy. Sugar baby. Yeah. Sugar baby. Whether you are a sugar baby or a prostitute or a porn star or someone's little... Or a stripper. Dark secret. Or a stripper or... A mistress. A mistress. Or anything, anything at all that has to do with an exchange of money, whether it is that he puts you in a nice, you know, penthouse or he buys you clothes or he pays for your rent, you're exchanging sex for money. Yes. So, where do we get off, you know, deciding that... Because it threatens... There's no price on sexual... No, no. It's all a price. There's always a price. But I think that for people that aren't as comfortable with that, especially for a lot of women, is that it requires... I think sometimes we want to shut down our sexuality for whatever reason. I think a lot of women do. They want to shut it down. They want to feel like they're being pursued. They want to feel what all of these... You know, they want to feel like it's worth something. And when you get into a long-term relationship, especially, I think a lot of women can feel threatened by these sluts of our society because they're so open and casual with their sexuality and they're threatened that their partner will leave them. Okay. I think that's really... We'll leave them for a slut? We'll leave them for a slut. Leave them for that young 28-year-old that's sitting in the office with her skirt hiked up. We'll leave them for a 20-year-old stripper. Because here's the thing. Some men are idiots and they do. Of course. Of course. But they're idiots regardless. It's not going to matter what you do. And that's the thing that's hard is women blame other women for the fact that their man's an idiot. Right. Or that this man that they chose to be with is an idiot. When in reality, where the anger should be is the fact that... Be there accidentally. Be there accidentally. Be there accidentally. Be there accidentally. Be there accidentally. Be there accidentally. But the man... This man is an idiot. Right. He's a piece of shit, brother. Yeah, and he was a piece of shit 20 years ago when you married him. Right. But you just didn't want to recognize it or there were other things that you thought were more important. Or that he was supporting you. Or that you were that 20-year-old stripper. It's very true. It's very true because there's a method to this system. I mean, nobody just wakes up and it's kind of characteristic. So I do think that men that tend to do this now will do this now. will do this now. And especially if they have a commodity, if they have something that they can use, whether it is a position, wealth, whatever it is, you can utilize it 20 years later. It doesn't really matter. So the security is really not there. I mean, it doesn't really matter. But the thing is, I want to relate to something that you mentioned that men will be tempted by someone else, someone that is maybe younger or more attractive or more loose. Open with this. Yeah. Just open. Just open. Just open. But... Loose sexually. Everybody is. Everybody is what? Everybody is. I mean, do you think that there are not hot guys walking around all the time with their shirts on? We fucking live in LA. Like, people are gorgeous. You know what I mean? And it's not picking someone that won't recognize the beauty in another person. It's picking someone that will recognize it, but also recognize the fact that what they would lose if you wanted to be with them for an extended period of time is way too much. Okay. That they would not even risk it. They're like, okay, that's great. Nice, fun flirtation. Moving on. You know, if that's what you want for the long term. And I think a lot of, you know, I think that's why it's really important for women to have more equal relationships also. Where we're getting it, you know, these sugar daddy, sugar baby type of relationships that a lot of women are seeking. What it is, is you're replaceable because you have a price tag on you even if it's not. All of them do. I mean, if it's not an equal relationship, it has no exchange of money. And we're talking about exchange of money in any form. As I said, you know, whether it is titled illegal or whether it is just, you know, an activity that you choose to do. An activity we choose to engage in such as having a roof over our head. Yeah, you know, or having nice clothes or having rent. I don't know, like stuff like that. But in general, I want to go back to it because there are a few studies that show that men in college, for instance, didn't find the horror, you know, the slut stigma relating to women as women that they're actually going to take home. Take home to mama. Right. Because they were women and a lot of them, it was despicable. A lot of them really titled it, we're going to celebrate with sluts until we find a good woman. Right. That was the definition. And the thing is that it doesn't really, you know, there's really no competition if you are that good woman versus the stigma of the slut. I mean, because if you are involved in, if you are depicted as a slut, then, you know, what are you going to do? How are you going to really wash it off? That's a big... How do you wash off the stigma? How do you wash off the stank of being a skank or a slut? Yes, the stank of being a skank. I love that. The stank of being a skank. Yes. You know, it was so horrible that these men actually even said when they were questioned about the double standard that I want to really discuss. They were asked if a woman under the circumstances of date rape, of date rape, and I want to really discuss it because it's so terrible that in this day and age, it's still going on. But men were asked, is that woman that was allegedly loose and a slut, was date raped, was she someone that deserved it? And most of them said yes. That's because they're disgusting. You know how you wash off the stank of the skankiness? Yes. You grow up and you meet a man who doesn't believe in those stupid things. You grow up and you kind of, like if somebody talks about other women that way, then you say, fuck you because you're a piece of shit. Okay. If you're a man and you just walk away and you have respect, you have respect for yourself, you hold your head up high because really, at the end of the day, the only people putting those titles on you or those labels on you are people who are really fucked up. And have no self-confidence. And have no self-confidence and no self-esteem or are very insecure. And you know, if you're comfortable enough with your sexuality to be called a skank or a slut and hold yourself and be like, yeah, so what? Fuck you and go fuck yourself. And that sums it up. And that sums it up. I agree. I agree with you. But I do have to say that Charles Cooley had a theory that he called the looking glass self. And what it actually said is that people shape their concept of themselves according to how society perceives them. And that goes on and on into, you know, details. But the thing is, you were talking about that woman being slut bashed. And shamed. Holding her head high and thinking of herself as just, you know, a plain woman is in seeking of her comfortability or her sexuality in a correct manner. Which is never possible. You know, because society will always put labels. But do you, are you really able to do this with the judgment that is coming socially so heavily? And with these men that say, oh, you're right. You're raped. You deserved it. Or, you know, questions like that. How do you really deal with it as a young woman? I mean, I think as a more grown woman, maybe when you're in your 30s, you're more able to do this. But I read a few testimonials of college students, young women. Young women. They were just on a verge of, you know, being suicidal because of that stigma. And that, you know, that is not something that is rare. I mean, it's pretty common. No, it is. It is. It's extremely common that women feel so depressed from these stigmas and these statements and these labels that you're a whore, that you're a slut, that you're a skank, that you're a hoe. And as they said, you know, it really didn't have to do with your sexual... It's just like that sick thing that you're describing in Scarlet Letter where we want these whores and sluts to kill themselves. We want them to die and disappear. We wish death upon them. Yes, as women. As women. Because... That is why I believe that the part that women play in this bashing is by far more intense and by far more painful than, you know, the aggressive part that men play in this equation. Because the non-aggressive way... A passive-aggressive way? Oh, yeah. Mean girls. I mean, the way women relate to other women, even just standing on the side of a room and bashing and talking and looking could put a woman, you know, on the verge of a suicide. I mean, really. And some women really described it as that. So... I absolutely... You know, here's the thing. As a... I did not have a lot of female friends growing up. I was a late bloomer. I believed in playing sports until I was 13. I didn't understand that girls were standing aside talking about boys because I was playing basketball with boys. And I think unbeknownst to me, the reason so many women were so uncomfortable with me and really excluded me was because here I am, scrawny little, like, knees and elbows little Luann playing freaking basketball with the hot guys in class and not thinking anything of it because I was a late bloomer. I wasn't really thinking, like, oh, like... He's a hot guy. He's a hot guy. Let me, like, rub up against him. I was like... I'm like, pass me the ball. Not that ball. I don't understand. The other ball. I'm like... But, you know, it's because of that... It's this weird... It's, again, like that, like, feeling as though there's some sort of competition for men. Yeah. And it's like this, you know, there's competition for men that we create, that women create. And therefore, a woman that's comfortable with her sexuality or even just unaware of her sexuality and around young gentlemen. Young gentlemen. Young gentlemen. That is so beautiful. I mean... Yes. You know, I was like, that's doing that. That's comfortable with men in general. Yeah. That there's some... There has to be something wrong with her. Right. We have to get away from women like that because we can't have women that are so comfortable. Can we get away from women like that? I mean, it's like... No. More women need to be comfortable with men and not see them as, like, commodities. Or with women and, you know, not see them as competition. Exactly. I mean, Laura Tenenbaum in her great book, Slut. That's the name of the book and I think it's... It's terrific. She talks about really growing up in, you know, in an era that is post-feminism of the 60s and the 70s, which is by far, by far worse. And I'll tell you why. Because we were raised to believe that we can do everything that a man can. And then, you come across sexuality. And now, oops, this one, no, whoa, stop right there. You cannot. So you're just, you're just pushed to be sexually alluring but not really engaging in sex. Engaging in anything. And not really relate to your desires or your sexuality. But you're supposed to be this attractive thing for men. Right. Because you have to be beautiful and sexy and turn them on. And sexy. But don't sleep with them. Right. Because that makes you a whore. Right. A slut. You're a slut. That's Britney Spears when we were 16. Right. And she, yeah, it doesn't matter if it's Madonna or Britney Spears. It's actually the same thing. Exactly. I mean, we still, we just name it differently. Yeah. But the message is the same. That if you are a fallen woman, so, you know, you really don't have a place in society. Right. And you'll be bashed and put to the ground by your counterparts, your female counterparts. Big thing. Men are not commodities. Women are not competition. I mean, it is a big thing. But the question is, is it really possible to get around it? Well, I hope with education, I feel, you know, and further education of our youth. You know, seriously, at this point, I'm like, fuck the 20, 30 year olds. Like, forget the 40 year old. Just kidding. They are long gone. You know, I was like, 60 year old women. Great. They're like, we've been through this whole thing. We know what it's about. It's like, but there are certain generations where it's just like, fuck them. Let's go with the, let's go with the 10 year olds. Let's start teaching our young girls and boys. That's the other thing. Teaching young men too about, you know, about respecting women and sexuality and equality. I think that needs to start from a young age. You know, it's just, it's not, that's the only way that we're going to get better at this is by educating our children about the importance of gender and sexual equality. I so agree. And the last thing I really want to mention because you mentioned the young generation is that the new trend that is actually taking place in making sure women are kept cobwebbed and secure is something called the purity ball. Have you heard of it? That's bullshit. Have you heard of it? Yes, of course I've heard of that. That's such bullshit. Yeah. I thought, you know, initiated in 1998. I thought it was 1888. Yeah, it's sick. But should I just explain what it is? Okay. So the purity ball is composed of fathers and daughters and can go all the way to the age of four, by the way, even though menstruation, is a part of it. If you have your period, you're invited. The thing is, it's kind of, yeah, and agree. I really kind of, I think I vomited in my mouth. It's disgusting. But they, yeah, the ball is really generated to make like a pact between fathers and daughters. A father and a daughter. That's sick. Right, that she's not going to sleep with anyone and he's going to protect her hymen. That's disgusting. That's disgusting. With his hands. You know, some feminists actually claim that it's, kind of incestuous. It is. It is. It's so sick. It's so sick. Fathers, daughters. That's a sick, sick, oh my God. That's like, you know what? But that's a new thing. Purity balls are taking place for, you know, quite a while now and people are engaging in this and, and, you know, advocating it. Ugh. What kind of people? Because they're not invited to any of my parties. No, no, no. You're not invited to the purity ball. I am not invited. I am a whore and I am proud. I am a slutty whore. I am a slutty whore. I know, I know. It's like, it's so good to be. But honestly, yeah, so. I feel like that should be our topic for next week. Purity balls and how fucked up they are. Yeah, it should be. No, but seriously, we really want to have a show about prostitution and we're almost there. I know. Freaking A, man. I'm about to take off my shirt. I know you should. At least in the back. Just lift it up halfway. Okay. So, yeah. So, I want to wrap it up and say that we had a ball. Not a purity ball. Not a purity ball. But that shit. We had, yeah, we had a lecherous ball and a lewdness ball and we're very excited to get your questions or your emails and you have our numbers, you have our emails and everything and please, and yeah, of course, and of course, you can find us on iTunes which is the most important thing. Right. Yeah. Yes. Please subscribe to us. We promise we'll keep you entertained. Yeah. Eventually, this shirt is probably going to come off. We're with the purity ball. I know. Oh, my God. Okay. Yeah. That's all right. I'm way past that purity ball. That purity ball left years ago over a decade. I know. I know. So, yeah. So, we want to say thank you for joining us this evening and please, please join us next Sunday. It's better than a purity ball. It is. It's better than a purity ball. I may have more excitement for you. Oh, I'm sure. I'm sure. I'm sure. So, thank you, honey. I'm Dr. Lemore Blockman. And I'm Luann Hernandez. Have a good evening. Bye. Bye-bye. Rush. Rush for fantasy. We want Rush. Rush for fantasy. We want you