Game show producer Bob Bowden interview plus custom game show segment

I'm Vic Coen, and it's a fair question. Hello, this is Vic Coen broadcasting live from stunning, beautiful Skid Row Studios in downtown Los Angeles, California. And the name of the show is It's a Fair Question. because on this show, every question is a fair question. That's right. There's absolutely no question that is ever too personal or ever off limits. And tonight, I gotta say, I am thrilled to have this very special guest in our studio sitting right across from me. Now, I had the good fortune to recently work with him on GSN's Game Show Network's hit new game show, The Chase, where he is executive producer. Now, he's known in Hollywood by many as a bit of a game show guru because, well, it's unlikely that there's probably a game show that you've seen that in some way he hasn't worked on. He's worked on so many and he continues to be so prolific. Welcome to the show, Bob Bowden. Thank you very much, Vic. It's Vic. It's Vic, right? Yes, it is Vic. We should have spent more time talking. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they're like, yeah, you worked with him. You know, Bob's big. His biggest strength is getting to know his staff. Yeah, Bob with one O. Well, some of the credits for just for you, for those who aren't familiar with your work, I've noticed you've worked on Jeopardy, Family Feud, Don't Forget the Lyrics, and the list just goes on. And I don't want to spend the whole hour just going over your credits. Neither do I. Yeah. But the most recent show is The Chase, where you and I had the good fortune to work. I'm very, very proud of The Chase. It's a wonderful format. It's been extremely successful. It's been successful in England. And GSN had the great sense to license the format from ITV Studios. And it's been on GSN since August. It's done very nicely. We're premiering our second season on November 5th, Tuesday at 8 o'clock Eastern and Pacific time. So we have 11 more shows that are going to air. And we're very, very excited about them. They're great. They're very good shows. I can tell you that. Now, my recollection is that GSN, and again, GSN, for those of you, there might be one or two, Game Show Network. They have their own cable channel. And if you haven't seen them, check them out. They were so excited, if my memory is correct, with the first set of shows that were shot, did they not order more before they even aired? Yes. This was unprecedented, not only for GSN, but in the industry overall. We hadn't even delivered an episode for the first season. Explain what delivering means. Delivering, well, once we tape the show in the studio, and then it goes into a post-production process where we edit the show down to time. Add the music, sound effects, a lot of that. All of that. And so it takes a couple of weeks after we finish shooting to deliver the first episode. And we get notes from the network and we address those notes. And typically, after the season is delivered, they start to air the shows. And then, based on the performance, they'll determine whether they're going to air the show or not. And then, based on the performance, they'll determine whether they're going to air the show or not. And then, based on the performance, they'll determine whether they're going to pick it up for a second season. In this case, GSN jumped to the second season pickup before we even delivered one episode. Has that ever happened in your... It's never happened at GSN and it rarely, rarely happens in the industry. It's a risky move. It's a bold move. But GSN apparently believed in the show. And we're very happy with what we were doing. And they wanted more of it. And how many shows aired that first cycle? Was it eight? Six. Six. Okay. Yeah. But I think... Did we shoot eight? We shot eight. Two of them were held back for what's going to be second season for scheduling reasons. Great. So, and those six did very well in the ratings, correct? Very well. Yes. Very well. Okay. The shows held up nicely. Excellent. Well, it was a lot of fun. I had a great time working with you. Thank you. I did too. You did a great job. Well, thank you, you know, and you too. And we've been wanting to... I've been wanting to work with you for years. So, I finally got my chance. And, you know, if you're working in game shows, it's kind of a... I think part of your career, you need to work with Bob Bowdo. Well, I've worked with him. He's a nice guy. Yeah, that's what I've heard. You've never been able to get away from him. No, can't. Now, I put up on Facebook that you were going to be my guest. And I got a flurry of activity of likes and comments. And now, I do have a lot of friends, Facebook friends, who work in the game show world and in television. But it did strike me at how many people were excited that you were going to be on the show. What is that? Well, it beats me. I mean, I paid some of them. So, that's, you know, part of it. But... and you only put it up a couple of hours ago. So, it's not like, you know, people have had a week or two to absorb this. I really don't know. I mean, there is a fascination with game shows out there. Certainly, I subscribe to that. There are a lot of fans. There are a lot of people who are, I guess, interested in how they're put together. And what goes into making one. And that's, you know, that's a lot of what I've done over the years. Well, to me, my take on it was that there was an interest in Bob Bowden. That it wasn't just about learning the mechanics of how a game show is put together or that kind of thing. Well, thank you. And I thought that was quite interesting. Yeah, thank you. Now, the question on everyone's mind, I am sure. I'm going to speak for all of you because I know what you're thinking. It'll be a fair question. There are always fair questions. There are always fair questions, Bob. Yes. Now, you've worked on all these shows. You're working on a show now that's considered to be a hit. The question is, when someone has that kind of success and is so prolific, everyone's thinking, Bob. It's the elephant in the room. And I have to ask, who have you slept with to get your way to the top? My wife. And what studio does she run? I can't say the name. Yeah. No, I, you know, I, to whatever extent you could still have an honest career in this town, I think I've had one. I've worked my way up. I came out to Los Angeles from New York where I grew up. Didn't know a soul. Where in New York were you from? Flushing, Queens. Okay. Just like the nanny. And so— Without the accent. Without the—well, I had a little more 35 years ago. But I really— Yeah. I really just—it sounds trite, but I came out with a dream. And my dream was to work in television. I had always loved game shows growing up. And when I was in grade school, middle school, high school, there were still a lot of game shows in New York. So I could entertain myself and my friends came along with me and we went to many tapings of the shows that were still left in New York. And as time went on, most of those shows either went away or they were gone. And most of those shows either went away or some moved to LA. The business really sort of shifted to LA. And I was graduating high school and I thought, I need to go to LA to follow my dream. And I know—I really know it sounds weird, but I came out here really just wanting to break into this thing. And sure enough, after pounding on doors and telling people about it, I said, I'm going to go to LA. I'm going to go to LA. I'm telling people of this bizarre dream that I had. Enough people cared and let me in. Now, when you say the dream, we need to be very specific. You're talking specifically about working on game shows. Pretty much, yeah. Correct? Not sitcoms, dramas? Pretty much. When I was looking at different colleges, UCLA was at the top of my list because I knew that they were connected to the industry. It was an affordable school that I thought I could get into at the same time. And I went to my high school counselor and I said, I want to go to UCLA. And he said, where's that? Very bright counselor. This is my high school. It's outside New York. He doesn't— Right. Everyone went down the street to the college that was near our high school, Queens College. And so when I said UCLA, he literally didn't know where it was. He had to look it up. So, and then he came back to me about a week later— Did he speak English? Yeah. He knew his stuff, but it was a very limited scope of schools that the kids went to. So he came back to me about a week later. He said, I sent away for a packet of information. I've got it for you. And he handed me an envelope from USC. And I guess he didn't know the difference, which, I mean, this wasn't 150 years ago. It was, you know, gosh, I hope it wasn't that long ago. But he really just didn't know anything. So I carried the ball from that point. I applied. I got in. And I— To UCLA. I went—got into UCLA. Got on a plane with all my belongings. Arrived at the dorm and started my life here. What dorm? Hedrick Hall. Hedrick Hall, room 466. Do you remember the number? 466. It's funny. That's the game show mind. Yeah. Right? Yeah, well, sort of, I suppose. Yeah. Yeah. No, I lived in that room for four years. I used to—I was a theater major, so I didn't have a lot of tests, which is why I chose theater to be majoring in. And so during finals week, I would hold Jeopardy! tournaments in the dorm because I never had finals. And I was the relief for everybody to take a break from studying. And we played Jeopardy! in the conference room in the dorm. At the time, Jeopardy! wasn't on the air. So I had the old box game from the 70s, and I would just bring that into the dorm lounge, and we would just play Jeopardy! every night at 11 o'clock. And I was the entertainment. So were you the host? I was the host. Was that your last hosting job? It should have been. It should have been, yeah. I do run-throughs every once in a while, but it's not my strength. Every—not every, but many people in the entertainment business from A to Z have a secret secretive job. They have a secret start. They had a secret passion to perform at one point. Has that ever been part of your Fybrick? Fabric? You know—or Fybrick. Thank you, Wick. I just created a new word. I—you know, I'm not really an in-front-of-the-camera guy. I like doing run-throughs because I, as a producer, I like to have the control over the format, and I like to understand the dynamics of the format so that when I hand it over to the real talent, to the host, I can relate to it. I can relate to what they have to absorb and what they have to manage in their mind to host a particular format, but I don't really have any desire to do it myself, and I'm not—that's not going to happen. For those of you who don't know what a run-through is, during the process of getting a show prepared to actually be taped, the producers test the format, kind of tweak it, and get a sense of how well it's working and what it's not. Okay. And where little changes might need to be made. Yeah. So that's where Bob would be in the trenches playing host. Yeah. Yeah. And it really is. It's partly to test the format, and when I do the run-throughs, it's really for me to understand the hosting role so that when I get a host into it, I can really train them properly. Speaking of hosts, one of the things that I have always found fascinating in working in game shows is how close to a tape day a show can be. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. is sometimes hired. Yeah, well, it's not ideal. It's not ideal. I mean, you do want some time, especially for a new format and sometimes for someone who hasn't either ever hosted a game show or hasn't done it frequently. You want some time to really allow them to drink it all in, to get it into their system and own it. Because it's one thing to just, you know, sort of read the lines and, you know, hello and welcome to our show. Here's how we play and you do this. And if you do that, then this will happen. And if you don't do this, then that'll happen. And, you know, it's easy enough to get through the mechanics, but to really own it, to understand the dynamics, what the players go through, what's in their mind, what value you bring to the process, it takes some time. It's not something that's just, you know, even the best hosts, when they learn a new format, it may be intuitive to them. The beats of the show may be intuitive to them, but the actual structure and what the design or the beauty of that particular format takes some time to unveil and own. And so if you get a host two, three days before you're taping, it's usually a disservice to the show and to the host. I 100% agree. And I was thinking as you were speaking about my days on Deal or No Deal as a creative consultant that which really meant I was writing for Howie Mandel and working with the producers and developing twists and turns in the game. It was a great experience. I remember I was very impressed with how hard Howie worked in preparing to host that show. Literally, he was in this basement with the creator of the show. I think he was Swedish or something. He's from another country, far, far away. Dick Turek. Yeah, that's right. The creator from Endemol. Endemol is a multinational company. Endemol is a multinational company. Endemol is a multinational company. Endemol is a multinational like I say, company, who creates formats. Global, yeah. Global would be a good word for it. And so this guy with this accent and very passionate about Deal or No Deal, it was cool to talk to him because he said, I believe he said he created the game using matchsticks. You never know how these games get created, but nevertheless, and if you haven't seen Deal or No Deal, this is the game with Howie Mandel with 26 models and 26 briefcases with someone hopefully getting the case with a million dollars. But nevertheless, Howie, it was like, this guy was like a drill specialist, right? And he was like, this guy was like, this guy was like, this guy was like, sergeant and it was work and I agree with you if Howie didn't if it wasn't in his DNA by the time that thing was done then I don't think he would have been able to be so uh you know just comfortable making it his own yeah absolutely you know um it it there's there's so many different skills involved in hosting a show and the ones who do it the best who make it look easy generally put in the most work to get there and um if you look at some of the best classic hosts of all time you know they worked quite hard to get to that who are we talking about in your mind Bob Barker is is you know a great example um if you go back a ways Bill Cullen um was a a wonderfully talented uh man who how do you spell that if we wanted to look him up on Bill Cullen c-u-l-l-e-n there's a brand new book out about him that I'm reading now um called Quizmaster and um he was an amazing host um and that's all he did you know Bob Barker used to say uh you know I don't sing I don't dance I don't tell Joe's jokes this is what I do and uh he did it among the best of anybody Monty Hall um Monty Hall an amazing amazing amazing man uh who uh was uh not only a great host but also a great producer he was one of the first creator producer producers to also host his own show and he was great at it I uh I had the good fortune to work on a newer version of let's make a deal not the one with um the current one Wayne Brady not that one but another one and actually this one was hosted by Billy Bush it was an NBC primetime special and his daughter Sharon was the executive producer and then Monty would come in quite often and um I asked Monty where they came up with the name uh let's make a deal and uh he said they were crossing Sunset and Vine having a conversation and I just thought that was so interesting that makes sense yeah because I just love to hear like where people think of certain ideas you know because they're just we're just peop everything's an idea it all comes from our brains and there was a show I was involved um in creating with uh with Dick Clark uh about uh 14 years ago now and uh we were uh trying to come up with the next, big quiz show after Millionaire had launched. And Dick's company called me in to have me work on this concept. And I came up with some ideas. I brought them in. We discussed them. And then we said, we need a catchy title. And the first title we had was All for One, which is not all that catchy. It described what the concept was at the time, but it really wasn't something that you go, oh, ah, that's a catchy name. So we were sitting in the conference room trying to figure out the beats to the show before we went in to pitch it. And we said, we need something that's going to just set everybody up to go, wow. And we said, I think I said, if I recall, it's got greed at its core. So maybe we say the greedy people, the greedy bunch, the greedy gang, the greediness. And Dick said. What about just greed? And everyone in the room lit up and said, it's so simple. It's so clean. It's what the show is. It's what many game shows are about. And it pops through. And so we got the title cleared. We pitched it with that title. And it got on the air on Fox, which was a perfect fit for Fox because Fox was edgy and younger skewing than the other broadcast networks. And that title. It meant something. And the rest of that show's history didn't last terribly long. But it had some success for a brief period. But it was a show about greed. And it was a perfect title that I was surprised nobody had ever used before. It's exciting, isn't it? When you come up with a show idea, a title, anything that everyone responds to. And then you see it being put out there. I've had those moments. It's amazing. It's very exciting. It's exciting. You know, another thing that many game show. Producers can relate to. And sometimes it's easy to forget this. But you have to remember it, I think, to be successful and to stay relevant. And that is that the people who come in and out of these shows, the contestants, they're civilians. They're, you know, average people who have a skill, a talent, something that makes them special. Special enough to play, to win, and special enough to get on the show. Whatever. Whatever, you know, telegenic qualities they have that a production team might be looking for. And in the time frame that they're on that show, we really change their lives. And I don't say that as in we're the most important thing that will ever happen to them. But for many people, it is the highlight of their life. And they may never experience something as life-changing or as life-affecting as being on that show. And that doesn't mean they have to win a million dollars. Or a new car or a trip around the world. It just means that for that brief time, they experience the catharsis of being on television, showing off their talents, getting whatever fame or recognition they feel they deserve or have been denied or seek or whatever. And then, you know, for many of them, a check arrives or a package arrives. And that's what they've earned. And for many people, that's life-changing. That's something that, you know. When you say, well, when you say you need to remind them, do you think producers forget that? It's easy to because when you're in an assembly line of shows and, you know, I mean, we've only done 17 episodes of The Chase and many of the shows I've done have had, you know, less than 100 episodes. But if you look at a show like, you know, Price is Right that's had, you know, 10,000 episodes, okay, it's easy to say, oh, you know what? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't remember what happened on show, you know, 6,427. But the people who are on episode 6,427 sure as heck do because that was the highest peak. That was the peak of their life. That was something that they'll never experience again. One thing that you're reminding me that I think is very important, what I've observed from working on a ton of game shows, not as many as you, but many, is that in my opinion, the show star is not the host necessarily. Now, you know, I've been in a lot of shows where I've been in a lot of shows where I've been in a lot of shows where I've been in a lot of shows where I've been in a lot of shows where I've been in a lot of shows where I've been in a lot of shows where I've You might have a star host, but I really ascribe to the idea that it's the contestants who are the stars. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And... In most shows, that's the case. You know, I mean, there are some exceptions, I'm sure. Yeah. But you even look at like singing shows, competitions, and the end of the day, while the judges are important, if the talent isn't there, there's really no show. Right. You know, a good host generally will understand that even though they're the front man or the front... Or the front woman, they are not necessarily the stars and that their job is to make the civilian contestants shine. And again, it is their moment. You know, the host goes through, you know, dozens or hundreds or thousands of episodes and it's their job and they, you know, come in and they do their shows and they go home. But those people who are there to win something, that's really special to them. And you need to keep that in mind, I think, if you do these shows. The one thing also that I find fascinating, I've been really lucky in that I've never worked with a host who didn't really give it his or her all. I've only worked with great people. But I'm always amazed when I hear stories about hosts who aren't happy to be there, don't want to be there, rude to the staff. Yep. Where is that coming from? Well, I don't think it necessarily is a function of them hosting a game show. I think they might be an unhappy person. They might, you know, feel they're in the wrong job. They might not get the show. They may not just, you know, understand it or like it or find it appealing. You know, some might not feel it's a good career move for them. You know, game shows continually fight the perception that they're, you know, not the classiest form of television, even though they're one of the most enduring forms of television. So some hosts, you know, sometimes celebrity hosts. That's who I was thinking of. Yeah. Sometimes they do a show because they have to or they have a deal that requires them to or a manager or an agent told them they should. You know, sometimes it's not because they want to be there. And that doesn't usually turn out too well. Right. And you can tell as a viewer that they're not enjoying themselves. And it's just like when we brief contestants, you know, what we say to them is that if you're having a good time, the people who are watching you will have a good time watching you and they will watch the show. They'll enjoy the show. And we say that selfishly because we want people to enjoy the show. But for the people who are on it, I don't think there's anything much more true than that. Is if you're enjoying yourself, people will enjoy watching you. And that doesn't mean you have to be fake smiling all the time. You know. If you lose, you should have the sincere reaction to losing. And that is genuine and that's real. And that is, you know, one of the foundations of game shows. It's human interaction. It's genuine emotion. Wish fulfillment. I mean, all of these things go into the blender. Well, Bob, sorry to interrupt. My feeling is, I think you'd agree with me, it's really the first form of reality TV. In many ways, yes. I mean, you know, you can trace reality TV. Maybe back to, you know, five or six different routes. You could say candid camera. You could say real world. You could say real people. Well, I would say candid camera for a real world. I mean. Yeah. Well, and it was, you know, a non-scripted entertainment vehicle. It started on radio. It moved as candid microphone. It moved to television. I think there's a pretty good school of thought that that was the first reality show on TV. And, you know, game shows, to the extent that there is no script, that you don't know how it's going to happen, how it's going to end. There's a format. There's a structure. And, you know, to the extent that the lines of dialogue for the host, the rules and so forth are scripted. But beyond that, who knows what's going to happen? You know. Right. And also that's true behind the scenes. Absolutely. The craziness of the business. That's a different game. Yeah. You should have some idea what's going to happen behind the scenes. I'm talking careers, though. Yeah. Well. Careers are like, you know, there's often a lot of uncertainty and not knowing what's happening and things like that, which happens. Well, it's a business that's in continual evolution, just like any other form of television. You know, I mean, there have been periods of time when sitcoms were more popular than other times and dramas were more popular than other times and reality shows and game shows. You know, there's not as much activity in primetime for game shows as there once was. For quite a while, there were none at all. And then Millionaire, you know, started a whole new generation of primetime games, which has led to, you know, some really good, interesting formats, some of which have endured nicely. But it's cyclical. You know, sometimes there's a lot. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Getting back to you had talked about how game shows. Sometimes in the past haven't been looked at as a maybe like an A-type form of television, you know, kind of like taking second backseat to other forms. And I think the change happened more recently with one of the changes was when Howie Mandel, Howie took over or not took over. He actually was the first host. He didn't take over anything. But when he took Deal or No Deal, and I think he, as a host, showed people that you can actually become a bigger star. Why not canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled canceled very few of them were actors or comedians. Hosts were regarded as sort of a different category of talent. Then as the business evolved over the years, there were a few celebrity hosts here and there who would take on a show, but it wasn't the trend. And the newer trend of celebrity hosts, comedians, and actors becoming hosts really was largely established by Deal or No Deal because it showed that you can be a talented performer in another world and be a game show host, and that's okay. And what Howie did, and again, it was like a privilege to be ringside through that whole thing, both the primetime and the syndicated version of that show, is while the contestants were still the stars, it was Howie's show. He owned the show. Very much. And that sent a new message, I think, to other personnel that were like, oh, I'm going to do this. That they too could have a venue for themselves in the game show world. And I think, Bob, I think that game shows are the perfect format for a comic. You're in the moment. You need to be in the moment and listening. There's no question that the talents of game show hosts do overlap those of comedians. The idea of being in tune with your audience, being able to have a relationship, a remark that is unscripted, that's spontaneous. In the moment. In the moment. Dealing with people, whether it's on a bad level, a heckler in an audience, on a good level, somebody who's really enjoying your work and laughing out loud. Those ranges of talents, I think, do apply in some ways to games. It depends on the show. I don't know if a comedian would be a good host for Jeopardy, for instance. Yeah, and I don't think that's... I agree, that's not the right format for it. Because that truly is the format is 100% the show with somewhat of a brainy cerebral host. Sure. Although humor is always a plus. Even some of the more serious hosts over the years have made people laugh and smile. I mean, you don't want to be so down in the dumps that nobody's enjoying the show. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. And it goes back to what we said earlier, which is that they have to be the star. Yeah, and a great comic, this is where it has to be the right comic, because a comic might, some comics may not understand that this isn't a, you know, one hour, half hour at the improv, or whatever, you know, HBO special, Comedy Central, this is about the show, and the jokes come, and what a lot of comics don't know is that, guess what, gets cut. Yeah, well, yeah. It's not going to be the gameplay. If a comic comes on thinking that they're going to use this as a tour de force for their comedy routine, they're generally not going to succeed. Exactly. I agree. Because the shows, for the most part, are heavily formatted. You have to hit the beats. You have to be a traffic cop. You have to honor the mechanics of the show. And if you resist that and all you want to do is be funny, your audience may enjoy your humor and your performance, but they're not going to understand or be invested in the game as much. And that's what your job is. And I think that, through you as the executive producer, can pull people back. And that's why you've run throughs and work on that part of the performance as well. Yeah. But a lot of people don't, what I've observed, which I think a lot of people don't appreciate, is that when a host is doing his or her job, 99% of the time there's a studio audience. And that audience, those are live people responding in the moment. So there are two shows going on. The host is performing for the at-home audience and for the studio audience. And I have seen some hosts who've never been in front of a live audience not be able to make it work, particularly in talk shows. Yeah. You know, there was one in particular who'd never been in a talk show, never done anything live. Uh-huh. And she pretty much froze. Well, and the opposite can be true, too, where the host plays to the studio audience and might lose sight that there's a camera on them. Yeah. And very often, you've got... You've got to connect with the camera, with the home audience. So if you're used to live venues with studio audiences or the venue of a comedy club, let's say, you may not, you know, have that connection to the camera. And you might be thought of as detached from the show by the home viewers because they're not in the audience. They're at home. So you have to balance that. And a good host will know how to play both and understand the difference. Yes. Now, a lot of people, as I said at the top of the show, kind of think of you as a game show guru, someone who they turn to get thoughts on formats and things like that. How would you say you've earned that esteem? Where does that come from? Is it simply you've worked on a bunch of successful shows, so it's a small community and people kind of respect your opinion for that? Or, I mean, where do you think this comes from? Well, you know, I mean, I'm not honestly sure. I have earned it yet. I would hope to earn it over time. Well, you ran Game Show Network. Is that correct? I ran programming for Game Show Network. I wasn't the president. Okay. But that is a big job. Yes. Right? And that comes to someone who really knows games. Yeah. And, I mean, I don't want to, you know, diminish my experience or what I've done. But if you're really good at this, you're learning every day. And I don't profess to know it all. I don't. I don't profess to be the best producer. I think there are many that have had, you know, far better careers than I've had. I think what carries me into that level of respect, if there is such a thing anymore in this town, is my passion for it. And it's not just a job to me. There are some game show producers who look at game shows as, yeah, oh, yeah, listen, I couldn't get the reality show, so I took the game show. And I never look at it that way. I'm proud to get the game show. I'd love to, you know, do more in the reality space as well, just because there aren't that many game shows, frankly. But I'm never embarrassed about it. I look at each game show that I do with the same passion and enthusiasm and excitement as I did when I was a kid watching them. And whether I succeed or, you know... To what level I succeed, I suppose, in this field, I keep coming back to how much I love it. And you can't manufacture that. You know, I'm proud of the shows I've done, most of them. There's a few I'm not, but I'm not going to name them. But I, you know, I don't look at any of them and say I didn't put my best into it. And that's because I love the form. But I'm learning it every day. There's all kinds of new things that I try to put into every show that I do. I never just go by the formula. Is there something you've recently learned that you'd like to share? Well, you know, the chase has been an amazing experience. It allowed me to do something that I hadn't done before, which was take an existing format, a successful format from another country, and adapt it for the U.S. And with the great support of ITV Studios and the tremendous help from the executive producers of the British format, who were by my side the whole time and helped me get through this, I was able to take something and tweak it ever so slightly so that it might work in this country in ways that are either cultural or established in the television landscape or are quirky. And I think that's what I've learned. I've learned a lot about this particular format. And the tweaks I made are very tiny, but I think meaningful to the American audience. And I'd never done that before. In all the years I've been doing game shows, I'd never taken a show from another country and brought it here. So, and that's apparently an important skill today because so many of the shows are imported from overseas. And whether it's Who Wants to Be a Millionaire or Weakest Link or, gosh, any number of other formats, it's a great skill. And the other countries create them, establish them, and keep them running. And it's the job of the American producers to figure out how to transfer that success here. And in some cases, it's don't change a thing. If you look at The Weakest Link, I don't think they changed a camera shot or a lighting cue or a music cue or anything from the British version to the U.S. version. They had the same host. And other shows have had major surgery done on them, Deal or No Deal included. The original format of Deal or No Deal overseas had the round or the show, I should say, the format that became the American format was just the end game. And the end game, for those of you who don't know, formatting would be the final round. The bonus round, yeah. So, that show had a lot of success. The show had a tremendous transformation. Now, Bob, you said that you came out to Los Angeles from New York, went to UCLA, and then jumped into working in television and particularly the game show world. We all have mentors. Mine, I would say, was Howie Mandel in many respects. And I think we all need mentors, someone who sees something in us that gives us an opportunity to express our creativity and blossom. So, who has been that mentor to you? There are three that come to mind. The first one is a gentleman who's left us named Barney McNulty. And Barney is the man who, I guess you would say, discovered me, although that's a silly word. It's not like I was at Schwab's Drugstore and he pulled me aside and made me a movie star. But I was in the audience of a... an interview show at UCLA when I was a student in 1978. And I was just there to watch the show. The premise was it was a one-hour live interview with Lucille Ball. Oh, that must have been amazing. And so, I was there attending UCLA and they said, do you want to sign up to be in this audience? I said, sure, I'll do that. And they took questions from the audience. They didn't screen the questions. It was live TV. I raised my hand. I asked a question to Lucille Ball. She gave me... What was the question? I asked her why she had never decided to do a variety show, which at the time was a pretty major form of television. And she went on with her answer and then turned it around to talk to me about, you know, well, what do I want to do? And I was blindsided because I didn't expect this to ever be about me. I just wanted to talk to Lucille Ball. And after the interview... I was in the audience. I was in the audience. And after the show, this wonderful man named Barney McNulty came up to me and said, what's your phone number, son? And I'm thinking like, why is this man asking me for my phone number? Hello. You know? And I tracked him down backstage and I said, you know, what is this about? And he says, I really liked your question. I thought you were very bright and I've got some work for you. And the next day, I started my career in television as a cue card boy. And I learned so much in those years that I did that. And Barney was my first mentor who really took me through... What was the show? The very first show I worked on was a George Burns special. It was called the George Burns 100th birthday special. He was only 86 at the time. But it was a CBS primetime special. And it was a parade of classic television stars. Lucille Ball, Milton Berle, Don Rickles, Carol Burnett, on and on and on. And I'm there. It's my first day backstage. Wait, your first day was on the show? Yes. Like there was no prepping or literally... No. He said, show up at Television City, which I had watched all those years. This is on Beverly and Fairfax. And he said, show up at Television City stage 33 tomorrow morning at 9 a.m. And I didn't know what I was getting into. And then there's this parade of classic TV stars walking in front of me. And I, you know, pinch me. I couldn't believe it. So I did that job while I was in college. Hold on. I want to just interrupt you for one moment. No, please. What is a cue card boy? Oh, I'm sorry. In the earliest days of television, before there were electronic teleprompters, which are the machines that today are computer driven, that give the talent their doting power. And I was in college. 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you were writing on the cards i was printing them and flipping them those are the two jobs so you're hand printing hand printing which is crazy because the the people who really do this you know who are professionals they have incredible immaculate handwriting well how do you know i don't well they didn't even test your handwriting they just said you're going to be the cue card no guy they didn't and and actually i was not the neatest by any stretch but i was one of the quickest writers and so whenever there was a pitch whenever there was we did a lot of the bob hope specials whenever he would change jokes last minute they would call me in to write up the cards really fast because he would change the whole monologue you know 10 minutes before we were going to to tape these are live sometimes they're always on tape i did a lot of live shows but his shows were were always ever put up the wrong joke um well the the the line that that became one of my nicknames over time was um because i was so fast at writing these cards but not the neatest uh they would sometimes integrate my cards into a deck that had already been printed by someone who had far better penmanship than i did and so you'd find a neat card a neat card a neat card and then my sloppy card right which had to be sloppy because it was fast and so one time we were flipping a monologue for bob hope and it was neat card neat card neat card bob's card at my card and he stopped dead in his tracks because he couldn't read my sloppy card after all the neat cards and he said who wrote that card the doorman so bob hope bob hope said that about my card so i became the doorman to to my many of my co-workers that's funny um who are the other two real quick two real quick one is a wonderful man named michael brockman who was my boss at cbs when i first became an executive there and taught me so much about daytime programming about game shows um and was a great guy and i was a great guy and i was a just a kind gentle soul who understood my passion uh and allowed me to to blossom and the third wait one second yes cliffhanger on number three but i want to get back to michael you said you worked daytime programming how long did you do that in a real brief sure i i uh started in research at the cbs television uh in 1983 and from the research department i moved into a management training program that i was very lucky to get chosen for and then i got to choose my job at the end of that program and i chose to work in daytime programming which at the time was a mix of game shows and soap operas okay for the most part got it michael became my boss and and wonderful mentor and i later worked for him at abc as well and great man uh and the third and and most famous of of the three is dick clark and dick clark was not only uh a uh amazing superstar talent that everybody knows but he was also to me a kind gentle soul who was almost like a dad to me um and he saw that my passion was uh what drove me and and he loved that i loved game shows and he loved having me around at least as far as i know he treated me so nicely um and and when it came time to find a show to compete with millionaire in 1999 um he had his company call me and said get bob in here i wanted to help us create a show ah that's amazing and and for that you know i i got to be an executive producer on a primetime show sharing a credit with dick clark which was a dream come true because when i was growing up in high school and i would go see tapings a pyramid um i would wait outside the stage door to get his autograph uh computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer computer 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Yeah, that's special. He got me. And when you have such a quirky passion, not everybody gets you, but he did. And I really miss him. Well, it does take people like that. We all get touched if we're lucky. And definitely that was a great thing because you can't even plan it. The connections and chemistry are just what they are. You couldn't have said, I'm going to meet Dick Clark and he's going to really enjoy me and he's going to see something in me and we're going to work. It's just either is there or not. As I worked for him for just a few years, it became a joke in the office that I was the guy who used to stand outside the stage door at Pyramid waiting for his autograph. So one of my nicknames, I tend to have a lot of nicknames, I don't know what it is, but one of my nicknames in that company was the stalker. That's not a nickname. No, but it was done with love and admiration. Because he knew that that's where it all started for me was, I just so wanted to be a part of this. And he respected that. Yeah. I mean, you're a great example of how passion can lead the way in hard work and good work. I try to share that with my kids. I try to tell them that no matter how life gets tough sometimes, if you keep your passion and if you stay focused on what you love and what you want to be and what you're about, it'll get you through the rough space. I don't want to get too heavy and philosophical here, but I'm going to. Okay. Bob, wouldn't you say that we all are living in our own personal game show? That's a fair question. It is a fair question. Everyone's looking for those cash and prizes as they go through life. Most people, I don't know if it's healthy, but I try not to because I don't find that a healthy state of mind. I mean, look, that's a little heady for me. I'm not really... I'm not really a philosopher. I'm a game show producer. I love it. And I do believe that one of the key principles of game shows is wish fulfillment and that everybody has that moment where they want to come on down and win something. But I can't really speak to the true psychological impact of being in your own game show. Well, I think it's an interesting idea. Maybe it's a little... It's for another show. Yeah, maybe another show. But if you think about it, Bob, I mean, truly, most people do go through life hoping to get something, whether it's a prize. Sure. And they find ways to achieve certain goals and dreams. And speaking of that, one of my wishes and that I am passionate about is being a game show host. Okay. So we're going to actually play a little game right now. Oh, we are? Yes. Okay. This is going to be my audition. Okay. It is a hostage situation, Bob. You have nowhere to go. That's true. That's true. But to partake. Now, when's the last time you were a contestant? Because you're going to be my contestant. Oh, my. I'm not a very good contestant. Well, I think you're going to do well because I have custom created these questions. Okay. Just for you. Jeremy, can we have some kind of game show music? Hello, it's Vic Cohn and welcome to Vic Cohn's It's a Fair Question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. Our first guest ever in the history of Vic Cohn's It's a Fair Question, the game show, is Bob Bowden. Welcome to the show, Bob. Well, hello there, Vic. You know, I think I called you Bob Bow-bem. Close enough. Okay. Are you ready for your first question? Maybe. Your first question, now, when working on, when working on The Chase, often I'd hear you say, free food, free food. Yes. So, I have, I've hand selected prizes that are food. Oh, thank you. Good. And for this question, you are going to get- Oh, cheese puffs. Some Simplify, that is the generic, you know, it's our first question. We have to build, you know, on our prizes. This is a real, made with real cheese, cheese puffs with zero grams of trans fat per serving. Okay, are you ready? And good for you. It's, you know what? It's great for you. And I think you, I can see you eating these on the way home in your car. Very likely, yes. Going home with orange fingers. Yes. Here is your question. Are you ready? Okay. Put 10 minutes on the clock. 10 minutes? I'm kidding. In what year did Alex Trebek first host Jeopardy? 1984. That is correct. I get the cheese puffs. He gets the cheese puffs. Now, you have a choice, Bob. Yeah. You can keep those cheese puffs and go home now. Okay. Or- Oh. You can play on for this two and a half pound- Oh. Bag of Brock's candy corn. You can hear it. No. If you are incorrect, then I'm going to have to take those cheese puffs back. Oh. And already in your bag. This is a tough question. Could be a benefit. Yes. Okay. Would you like to go on? I will risk the cheese puffs for the candy corn. Okay. Here we go. This is for cheese puffs. Yes. And a two and a half pound bag of Brock's candy corn. Yes. Here's your question. Please listen closely. Yes. Price is Right is the longest continuous running game show in the United States. Uh-huh. What is the second largest continuously running game show? The second longest continuously running- Yes. And it is running today. Uh, I would have to say Wheel of Fortune. That is correct. Okay. And you get that two and a half pound. All right. Now I might stop. The audience is- I can hear the audience yelling, stop. Well, before you decide- Yes. I have a pumpkin full, purple pumpkin full of incredible candy. Uh-huh. M&Ms and all those fun size things I know you love. This is why you were at Walgreens before the show, right? Exactly. You're getting my prizes. Exactly. I was getting your prizes. All right. Now, Bob, you've already won a two and a half pound of Brock's candy corns. Yes. Right there. You've also won a beautiful bag of cheese puffs. Mm-hmm. And now up for grabs. This is about a pound and a half to two pounds of assorted chocolates, Twix, M&Ms, Starburst, and Snickers, everyone's favorites. Just when I need. Do you want to continue and play on? Is this the last question? Uh, there is a bonus question. There is a bonus question. Now, if I stop now- You stop now- Do I not get the bonus question? You do. Uh, we'll still give you that, but you will be out the candy. I'll be out the- Okay. Now, you've done very well. Yeah. I think that you have a little something to prove because I've been billing you as like this game show expert. Yeah, so- So, to leave now would kind of make you look a little lame. It's a no-win situation for me. If I risk and get it wrong, then I've lost the title, basically. That, yeah. I mean, but if you don't go, you kind of look like a wimp if you leave today. Okay, let's go for it. He's going for it. All right, here it is. For all this candy, and again, there's still one more question to go. Okay. Okay. Who was Wheel of Fortune's very first announcer in 1980? Well, Wheel of Fortune came on before 1980. Okay, we might have to go to our research department. Yes, yes. Wheel of Fortune came on January 6th, 1975. Okay, let's- I'm going to kill my- I should get the candy. I'm going to kill Wikipedia. I'm going to kill Wikipedia. Okay. I have a backup question. Okay, yes. See, this is why there's editing. Okay, yes. You know, like if we would cut this question and there would be a whole discussion, and this is a very serious question, Bob. Yes. It might sound frivolous. All right. It might sound frivolous. All right. All right. But it's not. All right. It's very serious. All right. And I really want you to take it seriously. All right. The question is, what letter cup size is Vanna White? You know, I've done a lot of research over the years. I've never really studied that. I don't know. A, B, or C? I'll say C. You are correct. Oh, my. Ding? Do we have a song? We have a ding. Wow. There it goes. You spared no expense on the sound effects. All right. That's right. That's Jeremy in there. I'm going to quit while I'm ahead. I've got enough candy for Halloween and then some. This one is kind of a gimme. A freebie. Okay. All right. Yes. And that is, what letter cup size am I? Let's see. Take a close look. I'm going to say A minus. Actually, it's a B. You are not a B. You're right. It is an A. It is an A. And you get for that a Gerard Deli chocolate squares dark in sea salt caramel. And we want to thank you all for listening and joining us. Thank you. We're not done with the interview, but we are done with the game show, Vic Cohen's It's a Fair Question. Can I have some music to take us away? Yeah. All right. Well, that was great, Bob. Well, thank you. How'd that feel? Pretty good. Pretty good. Back in the hot seat. I felt like a contestant. Are you feeling like maybe giving up the producing and just going back to hounding shows to be a contestant? I kind of like what I'm doing. Yeah. You're doing great. Don't stop. Thank you. I want to wrap up here with a couple of final questions. Okay. Where do you see the future of game shows? Mm-hmm. And I also want to know where you see your future. Oh, well. Let's start at the future of game shows. Sure. You know, I think game shows will continue to evolve like all other forms of entertainment. I think that they will continue to be adapted to different types of media, different types of platforms. I think that... Uh... The days of thinking of game shows only as, you know, linear television are over. I think that the core element of game shows, which is interactivity, be it with the live contestants in the studio or the viewers at home, I think has already been elevated well beyond that. And I think it will continue to be elevated. You know, there's been efforts made in the last few... Three months to get more and more people at home playing games on the web that interact with television shows. Mm-hmm. And I think that world is just really just beginning. I think ultimately there will be a lot more of that experience so that it's not just I have to tune in a show at a certain time on a certain channel to watch it. I think it will be ever-present. Do you predict a day where there is no TV? Everyone goes to their computer? Well... I mean, I'm not that much of a prognosticator. I would say that certainly there is going to be a continued convergence of platforms to the point where it will be less distinguishable as to what's TV, what is web, what is mobile. All of these things are already converging in different ways. My younger daughter... She looks at YouTube or whatever other web service that provides video and doesn't think of that as different from watching it on a television screen. Mm-hmm. It's all TV to her. And I think that's going to continue to be the prevalent force is that video, digital entertainment is what it's about regardless of the distribution source and the platform that it's on. And what about you? Where do you see yourself? What's the goal? Well, you know, I love what I'm doing. I would love to continue working. I am dedicated to, you know, a career as a producer. I could also wind up back in an executive job one day. I mean, I'm open to anything. I'm very fortunate to have, you know, a great resume. And a lot of skills that I've developed over the years. And, you know, I just want to work. I want to do what I love. And I'm doing it now. And I'm very grateful for that. Yeah. You know, listening to you reminds me of myself in one... You know, it's exactly like I'm hearing myself speak. But you have such a... There's so much gratitude I hear in your voice about the fact that you get to work in this business. Sure. I'm very lucky. I mean, you know... Everyone grows up with dreams. I have been fortunate enough to live out one of my big dreams. And I'm not done yet. No. I hope I have a lot more ahead of me. You're just beginning. And I'll tell you, you know, for me, it's like when I get a job, any job, anything I'm doing, even this right here, you know, this podcast, not to minimize it, but anything I'm doing. And I feel so privileged because I know there are so many other people that would love to be in that position. And it's such a gift to be able to do something you truly love. Well, and I think you're doing a great job. And I really enjoyed being on your show. You do your homework and you really bring a passion and an excitement to what you do as well. And I have a lot of respect for that. Well, thank you, Bob. That's really nice for you to say. And I know you mean it. So thank you. And I want to thank all of you again for joining us. It's been just a great hour with Bob Bowden. I learned so much. And there's so much more I wanted to talk to you about. So maybe we'll do it again sometime. I would love that. I would love that too. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And it's a fair question. It's a fair question. It's a fair question. I'm Vic Cohen. And it's a fair question. It's a fair. It's a fair. It's a fair. It's a fair question. I'm Vic Cohen. And it's a fair. It's a fair. It's a fair. It's a fair question.