Jean Franzblau on kink, BDSM, and her play

I'm Vic Cohen and it's a fair question. Yes, it is a fair question. Hello, this is Vic Cohen broadcasting live. Yes, it's live. This is really live from stunning, beautiful Skid Row Studios. in downtown Los Angeles, California. The name of the show is It's a Fair Question. Because on this show, every question is a fair question. That's right. There is absolutely no question ever that is too personal or ever off limits. And that's very important for you to remember tonight because we're getting kinky. Kinky, yes, we are. We're getting very kinky. So get in a kinky mood right now. Put yourselves, all of you listening, in a kinky space. I don't even know what that means. If you have a dungeon, get in it. That would be a kinky place. So my guest is a, I would say she's a very special woman. Her honesty and her openness is very admirable. And I always bring in people here who I find fascinating. And she is definitely one of them. Now, after a breakup about four years ago, my guest, sitting just three feet, maybe two and a half feet across from me, she realized after this breakup that there was a burning need for her to explore certain sexual curiosities. That's right. And we all have them, don't we? Yes, we do. Even you. Yes, we have them. But the difference is this lady, this woman, this girl, this female, she went for it. And she went for it in a very big and naughty and very, very kinky way. And then she wrote a play about her experience. And she's here to talk to you and me about her play and about her sexual awakening. Oh no. Yes, you have sexually awakened. I'm awake. Yes, you look it. I'm talking with Jean Franzblau. Nicely put. Yes, thank you. Now I'm getting direction from Mindy. Oh, she wants you on top of your mic. I'm on it now. Yes. So if you're, yes, okay. Thank you, it'll sound sexy. Ooh, yeah. Oh, well, you have no problem sounding sexy, Jean. Thanks. Now you are an actress, a playwright, and I'm calling you also a very vulnerable human being. Thank you for saying that. I am feeling vulnerable this evening. Yes, well, it's very appreciated. And I know that it's gonna be, it's what makes you special. Thank you. So thank you for opening up to us and sharing your story. Now the name for your show, your play is Coming Out Kinky, A Grown-Up Story. Okay, so before we get into the play and kind of the background of it and your life story, let's just talk really briefly about the kind of mechanics. Right now you're putting together a fundraiser, like a kickstart kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, I'm doing it on indiegogo.com, which is like Kickstarter. Okay, great. And what are you trying to do there? You're trying to raise money so that you can produce. You've written the play. That's right, I've written the play. I've done a preview performance. I've done a preview performance of the play, so I already know it's solid. And now I'm putting together a fundraiser to fund the world premiere of it, a full-length production, which in LA would be a five to six week run. Okay, great. And we'll get into more of that in a little bit. Sure. And if you wanted to find out more about it, just go to kinkyjean.com. That's right. Okay. Now, I'm gonna describe for those of you who aren't watching, I'm gonna describe Kinky Jean because he really doesn't look that kinky. I have to say. She's wearing a purple sweater, something you could probably get at your typical department store. It's very nice, but it's by no means provocative. Yeah, Banana Republic. Banana Republic, okay. She's got a black, it's layered. There's like a black, what would you call that? A t-shirt? We would call that a t-shirt. Okay, yeah. She's wearing a watch. She's got no, and a necklace, very modest necklace. There's nothing that, there's no piercings that I see. I don't even see any tattoos. She looks like a woman that would be a little bit more, you know, a little bit more, maybe perhaps a carpooling, a soccer mom. Oh no. I see her at maybe a PTA meeting. But definitely somebody who looks like a corporate trainer. Corporate trainer, because that's what you do. Yeah. Correct? You're very corporate, very buttoned down. I am. But looks can be deceiving because Jean is not just one thing, she's many things. Yep. So let's get right into it. Okay. Because I'm really curious. You've had some really interesting Facebook interchanges since we've talked about doing this show. That's right. But all above board. Nothing too, correct? Uh-huh. Very, very professional. Oh yes. Now, what makes you so kinky? I'm going to start listing some things. You're going to start listing some things? And you say yes or no. Oh good. Okay. Okay. I thought you wanted me to just come up with myself. Oh good. This is a yes or no. Oh, this is a yes or no. Oh no. And yes. I can't wait for this list. Group sex. Oh, Vic. Yes or no. It's a fair question. The show's called It's a Fair Question. We'll come back to that. We'll come back to that. Can I just say that? Yes. Group sounds very anonymous. Okay. I like the idea that whenever I'm with somebody or buddies, that they be people who I know and trust. Okay. How's that sound? So multiple partners at one time who you know and trust, you've been a part. I'm open to that. Okay, great. What about lesbian sex? I consider myself heterosexual. I once posted on a kinky website that I was heteroflexible and I had to back it down. That's funny. Because it's just not. I thought that was sexy and cool. Like it's cool to be bisexual and I just couldn't hang with it. It's not really what I fantasize about. And yet there are moments. What I've realized recently is that girls are so soft. You know, so I've done some cuddle parties. I've been to cuddle parties. I facilitate them. And I've had some snuggle experiences with girls. And what I mean by that is women. And they're just so soft. They really are. So soft. We'll get into the cuddle party in a little bit. Maybe if we have time, hopefully. But the idea of the cuddle party or snuggle party is people get together. It's not a sex party. And it's just what it sounds like. They snuggle. Pajamas. Right. They wear pajamas. That's very nice. I've been to one. You have? Just one? I've been to maybe two. Okay. I like snuggling. And I think women are very soft myself. Yeah. Now, what about S&M? Yes and yes. Sadism and masochism. Yes. Now, when you're inside of that world, which I am, they're using a new phrase I want to share with you, which is BDSM. Okay. Because folks in this world are very nerdy, very big on definitions, and BDSM covers a lot more ground. When you say this world, you're talking about the S&M BDSM world. I am. Okay. Which we call the scene. Okay. It's very dramatic. People are very dramatic in this geeky world. Okay. And we call it the scene. I've been in the scene for several years. Okay. So what about when the S&M world, what are the proclivities? What are the things that particularly hit your heart? Hot button? Mm-hmm. So I discovered it first. Oh, this is such a crazy story, Vic. Yeah. So there was a point in my life when I was out of work and I needed some cash. So I posted on Craigslist something that I've done a lot in the past, ever since I was a kid. So it's just something I do very easily, which is babysitting. Yes. And I receive, somebody contacted me and said, I have something I'd like to offer you that's different than babysitting. and he said, I'd like to clean your house for $20 an hour. And I'm like, well, that is what a maid does. No, thank you. And he's like, no, I want to clean your house, and I'm going to pay you $20 an hour. Oh, wow. Do you have his number? He's awesome, right? So that's when I first realized that there are men who are really hankering to be of service to a female in some way, shape, or form, and that's their kink. And who knew how much I would enjoy, like really enjoy. I did. Or he hired you. After I screened him. Okay. Lots of conversations, meeting for coffee. Now, let's just backtrack a minute. Isn't that kinky enough? It is kinky. I like that. It's a good story. And my home got clean, and I felt so sexy. And I wasn't kidding about getting his number. Here's the deal. What? There are a lot of kinky women, okay? And, you know, I'm listening to your story, and I'm like, oh, my God. There are a lot of girls, women, they like being spanked, or they want to spank someone. They have their thing, right? So what I want to first of all know is, who was Jean, meaning you, prior to, I guess, there was a breakup? So I want to know, like, what makes this awakening so unique and different? What were you like sexually prior to this breakup four years ago or so? Vanilla. What does that look like? Vanilla is another kink word for? I was heterosexual, typical, more typical. I wasn't doing super kinky things. So I guess what makes it big for me is that there were all this stuff that I'm exploring now that I feel so happy and vibrant, and you can see my eyes are shining and all that. That was being repressed. Year after year repressed. So why that was important to me is that when I said yes to myself, it opened up a box of energy. What was... How old were you when the breakup happened? In my 30s. So I discovered all this kinky stuff in my late 30s. Okay, so you're in your late 30s. Up to that point, you had only had sex with one person? No. When in a relationship? No, why would you think that? So you said vanilla. I don't know. To me, vanilla would be being in heterosexual relationships. Right, right. So monogamous. First of all, late bloomer. So the first time I had intercourse, I was 19. When did you masturbate when you were younger? Yes. At 14. Okay, so... I had discovered a book. When I was doing my play, I became quite curious. Like, where did all this kinkiness come from? Like, did it just sprout in my late 30s? But then I started to analyze the type of books that I was masturbating to as a teenager. And I'm like, oh. What were they? What were they? So there was this book called Maya, M-A-I-A, about a 15-year-old slave girl who's sold into slavery. Sexual slavery? Oh, hell no. Hells yeah. It's a whole fantasy world. Okay. With a lot of detail. Really? Okay. Yeah. What the hell just came off of this? Your mic cube came off. Don't worry about it. All right. Let's talk about this book. Okay. So you, at 15, discovered this book. Where was the book? Was it lying around? You found it in a bookstore? This is another thing, is that every book I ever found or magazine that I used to work with to enjoy my sexuality all came from my sister's room. Oh, okay. They're just around, these books. Okay. Around. Where did she get them? Good question, but she's four years older. You're the youngest of three? Yeah. You have a sister and a brother. Yeah. Okay. She was the oldest of my brother than myself. So for me, it was just like mana from heaven. Oh, there's another book. Flip, flip, flip. Read, read, read. Dog ear, dog ear. Page, page. Right. Yeah. So you're reading a book about, it sounds like S&M-ish kind of backdrop. Yes. And then you lost your virginity at 19. Were you in college? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I asked. I asked a guy out. I was very feminist, so I thought, that's something I haven't done. I'm going to do that. And we fell in love, like first date. Oh. That's nice. Yeah. So you had a college love. You had sex with this guy. Yeah. Went for six months. Okay. And that's when I crashed. So the breakup, I disintegrated. I was in so much emotional pain. And so all throughout my 20s, I was just basically looking to heal or trying to figure out what was going on for me. And a lot of therapy and other stuff to help me come to wellness. What was going on? I'm not, I think I had some daddy issues. I think I might be one of the few. Yeah. I've never heard of that. Certainly. And there's probably nobody in the audience who can identify. But having somebody I loved step away and just say, I'm through with this relationship, crushed. Were your parents divorced? No, no. They're still together, actually. So I'm a sensitive soul. Right. Okay. You know, they might've fought once and that made my daddy issues. No, it's probably not as simple as that. Okay. So you end up going on and having what would be considered typical, healthy, normal relationships in your 20s? I would say no, no, no, no, no, no. Were you dating at all? I was dating and sometimes I would like be with somebody for a couple months and then I would obsess. I mean, I really had a lot of imbalanced, I can't say I was super healthy in my 20s. Were you a sex and love addict? Yes. Were you a love addict? Are you a psychic? Well, it sounds like those are the characteristics. There is such a program for those of you listening. There's a 12 step program called Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous. Now a person who's a member of a program like that makes a commitment towards anonymity. So what I can tell you is, is that type of program exists and that kind of issue I had. Okay. And I'm feeling better. Right. After six years. So that was helpful. It sure was along with a lot of therapy. Right. So then you're feeling more healthy and you find a relationship in your 30s. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Where'd you go to dinner? We went to Pradeep's in Santa Monica, which is where we had our original date. And I made this bunch of slips of paper of like really sweet things of what I liked about him and loved about him and put it in a little satchel and gave it to him. And he would open one up and look at it every day. It was super sweet. So what happened with that relationship? What happened is that the way I see relationships now is that everyone is a growth experience. I don't think every relationship is a failure if it ends. And I don't think it's a success if it continues. And so I think this relationship hit its end point where all the personal growth and all the great stuff we could get from the relationship had completed. And yet I had no exit. I didn't know how to get out of it because I knew it would hurt his feelings. So you were done emotionally, but you didn't know how to exit. I had no idea how to exit. And I didn't know what to do. And also just a reminder. Get really on top of the mic. I'm on top of the mic. That's perfect. Yeah. Just get on top of it. Okay. Okay. Great. And so you end up eventually somehow this relationship ends. Yes. Longer. It went longer than it needed to. And it finally ended. And that, my friend, is when I gave myself the permission. I was so happy to have my freedom again because I was, you know, I had fidelity. I was loyal to the relationship because that was the definition of our relationship. It was monogamous. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. And when I had my freedom, I was ready to explore. Okay. Great. Now, how do we know or how do you know that what you're calling exploring, which it does sound like exploring, it wasn't an addiction? Good question. I ask myself that a lot. I have learned the difference between healthy sexuality and feeling crazy. And unfortunately, I am still wired that if I'm under a lot of stress, a lot of emotional pain, it can happen, although very rarely now, that I will start to have obsessive thoughts about sexuality, thinking that some sexual experience will fix it. It's a thing that happens, but so rare now. Okay. So I really do know the difference. And sometimes I'll do something intimate and I'll regret it and I'll have some pangs of regret and I'll rethink it. But that's all just about experimenting and learning and growing. Okay. It's outside of the scope of addiction. So you're very aware to keep an eye on it. I do keep an eye. You have a vigilant eye about it. I'm happy to say I haven't felt like the wiggy, like squirrely headed about that in a long time. Okay. So you break up, you did initiate the breakup with this guy, right? Yes. Okay. You're like 36, 37? Yeah, ish, somewhere in there. And so something clicks in you and you decide that you've been sexually repressed? Well, here's the dealio. Something happened between him and I that had me feeling unsafe. What was that? It's a fair question. It's a fair question. Every question's fair on this show. It is. It is. So what happened is we had in a sloppy way talked, he was really his idea, this idea of like, let's role play a little bit, but we didn't know anything about, I actually tried to establish a safe word because I wasn't feeling comfortable about it. In the meanwhile, stuff was going on where I had been concerned, did he have any problems? I was like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at I'm a sloppy drunk. Right, right. You're my girl. So I was concerned about that. And he was talking about, let's do this role play thing. And there we were at basically a dinner party. And basically, he touched me under the table in a way I did not want. Are you getting my meaning? Yes. And then wouldn't stop. So for him, this was like, but we were role playing, didn't you know? And the look on your face, I could tell you're like, that guy's a jerk. Well, it sounds like assault. It felt like that to me. And I didn't have a word for it for a long time. Because role playing, first of all, I love role playing. And role playing is you take on a role. Yeah. Both people do. Yeah. And it's fun. Yeah, it wasn't fun. It wasn't fun. That's not role playing. That's just attacking someone under the table with your hand or whatever he was using. So at the time, all I could do was try to explain to him I was upset and I wasn't feeling heard. But what I did notice, Vic. What I did notice, Vic, is that it began to hurt to have intercourse with him. It began to burn. It began to hurt. Okay. So we needed to fix me. And so I went to the gynecologist again and again and again to find out what was wrong with me. And finally, he figured out what it was. And it was called vaginismus. I've heard of that. Which is that the body clenches down. Yep. Basically, the body is saying, I don't want this in me. This is not a good idea. But I wasn't paying attention to the cues. Mm-hmm. So it took me. It took me a long time to pay attention to the cues and initiate a breakup. Is that what you were doing, locking your legs and he wasn't able to actually have sex? No, hon. No, no, no. Isn't that vaginismus? No, no. Just so you know, the locking is not of your legs. So we were not having a tussle. I was trying to give myself to him. Right. And you couldn't. And my vagina was locking. Okay. You can't see it as well. But my vagina was like, no, get him out of you. And that's what went down. Okay. So when the relationship was over, I was certain and very resentful that he had ruined. This is me in a victim state. Right. That he had ruined sex for me for the rest of my life. I thought I would have vaginismus for the rest of my life. So first order of business was I needed to figure out if that was the case. Wow. Some field studies. I needed to do some field studies. So I did have a date maybe a month after the breakup, though I was still grieving. I did want to have a date. And eventually I found out that vaginismus was very much connected to that partner, not to anyone else. Thank God. Hallelujah. I was really grateful. Yeah, that sounds good. Thank God. Now, if I'm listening like you all are listening to the show right now, and I am actually. Oh, good. I'm glad you're listening. I am here listening. I am thinking to myself, so far, Vic, I haven't heard anything that is kinky about this girl. Yeah. She talks about kinky. I know. But like, come on already. Where's the kink? I want to hear what the kinky is. All right. So tell me, what makes you so kinky? I think one thing that made me kinky is that I was willing to go on Craigslist and begin exploring the different things people were doing. Why didn't you answer any of my ads? I don't know. Maybe because we didn't like the same thing. No, impossible. Okay. So that was, and so what were those things? Okay. So one thing, I think the first thing I looked for was called MM for W. M means male. And then the second M means male. And then the four means this is what we're looking for. And then the W, that would be me. So these would be two guys looking for one girl. Yeah. So that's what you started doing. That's what I looked for. Okay. Okay. And it took me until just recently to finally manifest that experience. So are these bisexual men? That's what I was looking for. And how's that working out for you? Well, now that I've actually had some experience with that, I can see that in my future. Okay. And how, how meaning? Meaning like I want more of that. Okay. How many times have you had that? Um, well, I would say it was one very special night. Um, I'll just say once-ish. Okay. And what about the disease? I mean, doesn't that scare you? Yeah, it does. Uh, in, in. You could catch a cold, you know, and it is cold in flu season. I think it's really important to be aware of your STD status. And so people who are really sexual as I am, it's recommended that we get tested once a quarter and then learn how to have what there's a sex educator named Reed Mahalco. And he recommends you learning how to have an STD elevator talk, a quick back and forth. So you can clarify what does this partner need to know, which includes what does my current status have? I'd had any upsies since my last test. Is there anything you need to know? What do I like? What do I not like? And like that. Okay. So you've had your bisexual experience. What else makes you kinky? Uh, well, that's when, uh, after the bisexual experience, I met a friend who, well, wait a minute. I met a friend on Craigslist who became my running buddy and we kept, you know, trying things together. And he mentioned that there was a dungeon. An S and M dungeon in Los Angeles. And I was like completely fascinated and I asked him to take me. And so that was like the, the, uh, you know, the door that opened up the Pandora's box. So that's, that was your hot button. Who knew? I attended it. It was a very, uh, nerdy environment. Like meaning there I was in this, I actually do this in my show. I explore with the audience, like what it's like to be the first timer at an, at a BDSM club at a dungeon. So I was, what does that mean? Club? Well, there are a lot of places in Los Angeles and a lot of metropolitan cities. How many? Uh, there's, I could probably think of several in LA. One of them is called the sanctuary. Another one is called threshold. These can all be found online. Oh yes. It's legal. Yes. Yes. No actual sex happening. Correct. Uh, that's right. In California, there are certain things you can and cannot do. And when I say there's no sex, what I mean is there's no intercourse, oral sex, anal sex. What? Well, I should say that. If you were paying for the services of a professional dominant or submissive, you know, somebody to play with you and you're paying for that person. Yeah. There are really strict laws about that. And so just to be clear, you're not engaging in intercourse at these dungeons. You're engaging in S and M. I just want to clarify that there, there is a place called the lair, which you have to be invited to by someone who already is knows about it. Okay. Where. Yeah. So you can play as deeply as you want. Oh, okay. Is that a dungeon? Yeah. They call it that. It's mostly outdoors, that place. But you've been there. I have. I have. It's not my bag, but I've been, I've attended classes. Let me tell you BDSM people, super nerdy on the classes. BDSM. BDSM. B is bondage, D domination. The B is bondage. The D is dominance. The S is submission, but the B is also bondage and the S is also sadism. And then the M is masochism. So two of those letters have two different words, you know, words blended in there. Say that again. That's confusing. The B and the D is bondage and discipline. Okay. The D and the S is also dominance and submission. Okay. Then the S and the M is sadism and masochism. Okay. So a couple words are doing double duty. I'll have to, I'm going to have to play this back later. I'm not good at algebra, geometry, that kind of thing. Yeah. Trig. Yeah. Okay. So you go to the dungeon now. I went to the dungeon as a neophyte and nothing that much happened for me, but it awakened a hunger. And what's that hunger? The hunger was I wanted to know more about this and I wanted to experience it in a safe environment with somebody I could trust. Okay. And what is it you discovered and want more of? So what I discovered, well, what I wanted more of, what I was very keen on experiencing was being a submissive. Okay. I wanted to be submissive in a relationship with a safe partner. A safe partner who had a lot of skills in terms of keeping me safe, in terms of care, love and- How do you define, what would you be doing as a submissive if I were to turn a camera on you and your submissive moments? Well, you wouldn't unless, you know, but anyway- I'm just saying- I'm saying, okay, so- I know you don't videotape. Right. So- No. I'm just curious what goes on. Right. And this is really touchy to talk- For you. I will tell you, this is touchy to talk about, as you may guess. Because I am a very strong woman. I'm a business woman. I'm a savvy professional. I am an empowered communicator. It's important for me to be a role model to those that I know and all that. Right. So to say that I have an interest in playing in this way is pretty, can be very controversial and even upsetting. So I want to acknowledge that for those who are like, what is she about to say? Having said that, with all the power that I live with in the world, having to take care of myself and all that in the world, it is extremely relaxing for me to lose that control and to surrender to somebody who's safe, you know? Okay. And that would mean taking direction, doing what I'm told. Talk closer to the mic. It would mean taking- Get on top of the mic. It would mean- Look at me when I'm talking. That's good. You, you- Okay. Yeah. It would mean basically letting another person be the boss. Yeah. Yeah. The boss of my experience for a period of time that we would negotiate. Okay. Now when you say safe- Yeah. What's happening that's dangerous? Good point. There's a lot that can happen in terms- And I want you. I'm talking about you, not theoretical. Oh, mm-hmm. Well, first of all, I'm in danger of sometimes getting my feelings hurt. Oh, okay. Am I hurting them right now? Because I don't want to. No, no. What I mean, I'm actually talking about within the context of S&M Play. Yeah. Okay. So, like in playing, you're supposed to have safe words and the ones I use are yellow, which means I'm getting a little overwhelmed or red, which means everything stops. And it's really important for me to really trust myself and truly say yellow or red. What? Go on, sorry. So, there was one time when my partner was trusting that yellow and red were in my vocabulary and I would say them. And yet I was actually feeling kind of overwhelmed and wasn't saying anything. And so after our exchange was over, I was like, well, I'm going to be in trouble. I was like, my feelings are hurt. You did this. And he's like, wow, I feel like a monster right now because that's not our agreement. Our agreement is that you are clear about what's okay and what's not. Okay. So, when you're involved in the S&M thing, I'm not trying to diminish it. That's just what I'm calling it. The S&M Play, maybe it's more accurate. What is going on? I mean, I'll just throw some things out. Okay. Are you being tied up with rope? Sometimes. Okay. So, people who are into rope, there's a whole subset of them. They're like rope masters and there's even a subset of rope people called Kimbaku or Shibari folks who are- Isn't Shibari what you Jews do on Friday night? Is that? Oh, no, that's Shibari. It's a Japanese art form of rope tying and there's even six styles of that. But your point is, do I like to be bound? And the answer is in many circumstances, yes. Is that? When you say bound, I'm talking about tied up where you can't move. What about tape over your mouth? Tape does not sound good at all. I mean- They do sell that. I'm going to be honest with you. Oh, like if it's the tape that peels off nicely, that would be okay. I did some research. But don't use duct tape, people. Don't do that. Well, no, then we're getting into a whole nother world. I did some research for this show. Yeah, I bet you did. I did. Oh, really? Just for the show? I did. Interesting. Yeah. Tell us more. I went to Pleasure Chests after I knew you were going to be on the show. Aww. Yeah. First time there. Never. Yeah. Go, hey, Vic. You know there's a problem when you need a shopping cart. That wasn't the case. But I was looking around and I found it very interesting what was there. It's not my first time ever being in a sex store or seeing, but I want to refresh my memory. Nipple clamps, is that a part of your world? Yeah, it has been. Pain? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, so I've used them on others as a dominant and I've had them used on myself. It's not something I dream about, but it's pretty intense and powerful. It's for the lazy dominant who doesn't want to just keep his hand there. Okay. What about paddles? Spanking? Yeah. Yeah. So about the... A paddle is basically if you can imagine a sorority paddle, it's a piece of wood. That's something that if somebody's using it, better know what they're doing because even a light hit is going to have an impact. And yeah, I've been hit and I've used one and had one used on myself. Okay. Yeah. So what you're getting at is kind of what we call impact play. Okay. Is that an industry? So for everybody else watching from the outside, it's called, he's hitting her. We just call it impact and sensation. Okay. Impact and sensation, would that be always with a paddle? No, no. And what about with a whip, a riding whip? Look, let me tell you, the people who love this stuff the most, impact play, we're very into acronyms. O-T-K. Can you spell it? O-T-K. Can you imagine with that? Over the knee? Yes. You know what's funny? Hand spanking. Hand spanking. Is that part of your world? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. What's funny is I was really horny. I mean, not that that's a rarity, but I went on Craigslist. Craigslist is, I don't go there anymore and just, it's not really what it used to be. And neither do I. Neither do I because now I have a community of friends who are sexual. Yeah. Yeah. So I go on this thing and the woman says she's into CBT. Yes. I was wondering if you were going to bring up that acronym. So I'm like, yeah. What? No, you did not. I swear to God. Tell me you Googled it before you met with her. No. I didn't even meet her, but I put it in. Yes, I am. I am completely into CBT. Oh no. And then she's like, are you experienced? You know, she was very hardcore. Now, if you don't know what CBT is, it's cock and ball torture. Yeah. Which means I was going to probably be signing up to get kicked in the nuts. Maybe. Electrodes to my balls. Maybe. If I can clarify. Yeah. The people who fall into this scene are very dramatic with language. Yeah. And so it could actually just mean some very light play or maybe just scare my submissive a little bit. Okay. Or it can go into a deeper version of it. And there are people who have, and I've met a few, who have a very specific fetish of being kicked right in the nuts. And I can't understand how it's okay or how they are okay with it. It's their thing. This is what they like. Yeah. Now, do you like torturing a man's private parts? Nuts. Not so much. It's not something I think about all the time. Right. And yet it's not off the menu. There are moments where I'll be like, and what I just did just so you know what is- A little flick to the balls. Yeah. A little, not to the balls. No, that's not nice. Okay. That would be too hurtful. It's up to a dominant partner to know exactly what they're doing and make sure you're doing no damage. Jean, how much of your life, let's say in a week is spent- Oh no. In this world? Well, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Now that I've written a show and I'm in the midst of a campaign to support the show, I'm talking about sex quite a lot. I mean, I'm tweeting and blogging and Facebooking and sending updates to my 80 supporters and all that. So it's really on my mind and I'm talking about it a lot. But that aside, let's just think about it. I just went to a weekend workshop, which was very special on tantra. Okay. That was my first ever learning about the energy of sexuality. So that happened. Then I came home and I facilitated a snuggle party. So that happened. Right. So besides that, I am having a date or two in the next week in the weekend coming up, but those aren't partners, but dating. So does that give you an indication? A little bit. I mean, is sex on the brain 24 seven with you, would you say? No, no. I have to do things like look at my finances. Okay. My food. I went to Trader Joe's. Okay. That's a half hour. I drive sometimes here and there. I mean, are you having an orgasm a day? No. Two a day? No. Three? No. It depends actually, and many women listening would agree. It really depends on my hormones and where I'm at. Before we started the show, we were talking about testosterone and all of that. For me at a certain, basically when I'm ovulating is I believe as close as I will ever be to a man's everyday experience on testosterone. And I just want to say, for me, it's slightly fun because it doesn't last a ton of time. And it also is very annoying and frustrating. So I'm just wanted to say to you guys, I'm sorry, that's tough. It is. It's not easy. It's a tough road to hoe, as they say. I did purposely say hoe. You did. I did. And I might say it again. Sneaky. So you're very public about this. Now, I know you're a big fan of the show. I know you're a big fan of the show. I know you're a big fan of the show. I know you're a big fan of the show. I know you're a big fan of the show. I know you're a big fan of the show. Now there are a lot of women who would say, and I hear you ladies listening, you're like, of course, she's horny. She's like, you know, you're getting into your 30s. Women often become more sexual because they're more comfortable with themselves and hormonally perhaps? Yeah. And even in the early 40s there's a spike. So maybe you're typical. You're not necessarily kinky. You're just like a woman. Well, I mean, I think BDSM, we're thinking that people into that world might be 10%. And if you've ever wanted to play a little rough with your partner, you're kind of into BDSM, just so you know, my friends. But people who are deeper into it and geeking out and going to classes and such, a lot of us are saying there's probably one in 10 of us who are kind of into this stuff. Gina, are you a runaway train? I mean, what's it going to be like next year for you? I mean, could this thing get to the point where you're in like a daisy chain with 15 people, you know, and you're like God willing. But I mean, is there a danger that, like when is enough? Like what's too far? And I know I get it like being hurt, probably if you're getting beaten, that's not going to ever happen for you. But do you know what I'm saying? Like when do you get quenched? Yeah. I think. I think I'm understanding your question. And I've asked myself that too when I'm feeling really self-judgmental as well. And I'm not trying to judge you. I'm just curious. Right. I think it's true that this phase of my life might be more sexual than other phases because this past few years have been so beautiful, profound, and I've tapped into energy and I don't want to ever give that up. What I am finding is that there seems to be other, you know, every so often, I'll get an opportunity to experience yet something else I haven't tried. And I am really interested in trying things I've never tried before. So I'm an adventurer in this world. I certainly don't, sometimes I feel actually like I'm a little bit prudish within my community because I pay such close attention to what I'm ready for. So sometimes I'll go to an event and I'll be like, What's an event? Oh, like the snuggle party. Or I went to, you know, you would notice I went to Polypalooza last month, which was a four day workshop, experiential experience, you know, of learning about polyamory. Which is what? Which is the concept of having more than one love concurrently. So that could mean that you're married and you have a third lover that lives in, or it could be you're married and you're both able to have lovers outside of the relationship in a consensual way. Or it could be that you're married or it could mean like me that you date several people concurrently. Everyone is aware that I am not monogamous and I protect my partners and myself and I'm above board about it. And I call that solo polyamory. Solo polyamory being what exactly? The solo part is that my primary partner is myself. I'm focusing on my own growth and things like that. And that, so I'm not living with a partner. Although I think I'm ready to build, I'm ready to build a family of my choosing though, which is a big deal. And I certainly have never said so publicly. What does that mean, a family of my choosing? Well, it means my choosing would be, I don't think I want a child and yet I want what's called a family, which is, you know, somebody to look out for me when I come home and somebody who's going to pick me up from the airport and I'll do the same for him. What is leather mask? No. It's like, hey. I know. I'm just kidding. Yes. I'm joking. But my point is, is that- That sounds like a relationship. Yeah, yeah. But not necessarily a monogamous one. I don't think that's going to be- So there might be two guys picking you up at the airport. That's right. And they will be bisexual. Okay. I hope. Okay, good. Does that, that turns you on, the guys watching two men have sex? Oh, like nobody's business. And I'm so happy that now I've, now that I'm talking about this more publicly, I'm finding lots of women who like it too. I thought I was the only one. I'm the one who would watch reruns of Queer As Folk and just go just crazy looking at all that stuff. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that really gets you. It does. And you have an opportunity to experience it. Yes, yes. It was such a gift. It was such a gift. And I think I want to go out on a limb and tell you how that went down. Okay. So I was at this polyamorous conference, basically workshop. And we were at an event where they, the facilitator was Reed, who is very comfortable with me saying that, Reed Mihalko. And he was an excellent facilitator, teaching us all about, you know, setting boundaries and honoring ourselves and all of that good stuff. And he said, oh, at this event, you know, there is an opportunity to try a lot of different things. And I'd like for you, if you want to, be really courageous and raise your hand and tell everyone what it is you would like to experience. Okay. And so I had the guts to say the thing that I had been, I realized I wanted ever since I was 14. Mm-hmm. And so I raised my hand and said, it would be really nice if there would be two men who would kiss each other and let me watch. So it's just kissing. Whatever they would be willing to do, but that would be enough. Wow. And, you know, and so in the context of that experience, some guys kind of like wink winked and said, let's do this for Jean, you know, who would, you know, let's have Jean participate. So you just watched? At first, but let me tell you something. What happened for me when it happened that evening is my inner like teenager surfaced. I felt this incredible, incredible vulnerability and profound embarrassment. I felt like such, I'm using the word a lot, but I felt like a nerd. Mm-hmm. And so when these men, these lovely men were having, doing this for me, I was just, I was, it was like I was looking at the Beatles. I was so like, Which two? Which two? You know how it is, the girls would faint and stuff like that. That's how I was. And I was just so, I was like, they couldn't possibly be doing this because they want to. They're just doing it for me, right? But they actually, were enjoying themselves. I'm sure they were. It was so amazing. So you guys were all naked? No, no, not that I'm, no, no, no. Okay, I was imagining something much more sorted. I was imagining two naked guys kissing. They weren't, not that I'm remembering. So just watching them kiss, you being fully clothed, that was it. It was so lovely. Very innocent in an interesting way. So sweet, so sweet, yeah. So you got this play. Mm-hmm. How much is it costing you to produce? I'm raising $23,250. Is that specific enough? It is. Yeah, so that covers things like the venue and it covers a press person to help get press and it covers printing. And there's so much that goes into producing a play. Handcuffs, leather. Right, but also the cost of the director and lighting designer and all these things. Right, so you're going top notch. Mm-hmm. This isn't like- High quality. A small nook in the, you know, small theater. Mm-mm. Okay. You wanna do it beautifully. And it's a solo show. Solo polyamorous show. I'm the solo storyteller. I embody 20 characters, several of them men. Okay. Yeah. Now what is it, people might be listening thinking, God, this girl's horny. Yeah. What are the voices in your head that you say to yourself and how do you answer them? Well, the voices in my head are saying, Jean, are you gonna regret all the things you shared on this show tonight? So I'm having that, that happens. Is this unusual for you? Yes. Have you been more open than ever? Yes. Okay, well, thank you for that. I've told stuff I have not talked about. Okay, again, I do want, you know, this is a good thing to be reminded of. Yeah. When Jean and I spoke earlier, she was caught, she was very excited to do the show. I mean, very open about it, but there was also, I don't want there to be the feeling that Jean just basically is going everywhere around town talking about, oh, this is what I do sexually. In a way, this is probably, I'm guessing part of your experience, your sexuality through doing this in the show, in a way. In a way, what I'm trying to do is I'm trying to share the message that if I, somebody that you can like and trust, can give herself, give myself permission to explore, then maybe other people who are listening to this can ask them, can give themselves similar permission. That's my mission. And yeah, it does help me because the more open I am about my sexuality, the less energy I am taking to contain and, you know, who I am. Right. And I happen to, like, talking about these topics. Yeah. It just is what it is. I do too. Yeah. And I think that- We should do some more. Yeah, I like it. It's very interesting. And I like the honesty. What I always find interesting about honesty, Jean, is the more vulnerable and the more I share the embarrassing, what I imagine to be embarrassing, the more likable I become. Even though I think I'm going to somehow be less likable. People like vulnerability. It makes us human. That's what makes everyone, I think that not being vulnerable is where we end up in pain. I've had people tell me that, that there looked like I had a shell on sometimes, like I would have this persona. Yeah. And I'm hoping that there's less of that and that I can be just as powerful in the world by having an open heart. Why do you call yourself kinky? Well, I actually wanted to make sure I qualified as kinky because I think it's a cool word. Okay. So, yeah. I think it's a cool word. Well, I think people into BDSM are under the umbrella of kinkiness. So, because I like both, I consider myself 70% submissive and 30% dominant. Then I believe it simply fits into that. The fact that being bound helps me feel relaxed or being told what to do, I find very joyful. I mean, that's not everybody's typical thing. Okay. Now here's my thought on this. Okay. The only thing I think is kinky would be hair. People can have kinky hair. Okay. Okay. They're curly and tight. But I believe that what we consider or many can call kinky is just creative. I think of kinky as like, for example, I think role-playing is a really fun thing. And very creative. And it's creative. And anything that involves generally speaking, not all, but a lot of what we think of as kinky is actually stuff where we're creating a story within the sex. Yeah. Where we're being innovative. Where we're not just two bodies having sex. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. And I think it's, yeah. So I just think of what we call kinky as imaginative. Mm-hmm. You know, and I think that, I think everyone has it in them. I think there's a lot of things that there are a lot of people would like to try or would just enjoy checking out that they would consider taboo. If it's between consenting adults, why not? Is porn a part of your world? A little bit. You'll be surprised. Maybe you won't be surprised based on what I've told you. Gay porn? What? Gay porn? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So specifically on kink.com, there's a section, they have many different kind of stations because everyone has so many different slight, you know, kinds of kink. Right. There's a, I think it's still there. I haven't looked at it in a while, but there's this area of kink.com called Naked Combat. Naked Combat. Where the men wrestle. It's so sexy. That's fun. Yum, yum. Yeah. You're big, are you a big wrestling fan? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's free. Like, you know, yeah, all that. So what is it that you're still waiting to do? You know how the kissing piece happened? Well, I'd like there to be, to try more of that in the right circumstance. So, you know, to get past the nerdy, feeling and get into my body and really be present for it. And given that I'm with two caring friends, have more of an exploration of that. Now it's very, you know, it's like I said, it's very bold and it's very honest that you're talking so openly about this. And I'm just curious how much of this could be exhibitionism? A sense of, I know you're not, you don't look like you're getting off. You look very vulnerable right now, actually. But is there a sense of exhibitionism or not? Well, I will tell you this. When I was writing the show, I would workshop it. And I brought it to a lot of writing, I brought it to several writing teachers and they asked me the hard question, which is why would you want to write about this? Why would you ever want to share this, et cetera. So I had to really give a hard look to that. I also had to give a hard look to how it would impact my corporate career. I had to actually be willing to give it up completely without any assurance of what I would do next. I had so much fear about that talking about sexuality would make me a pariah. So it actually was a big risk. Do you work with Fortune 500 companies? I have, certainly. And what are you doing with them? What kind of work? Oh yeah, I give corporate training. So I'm giving customer service classes, this is not to a Fortune 500 company, but soon I'll be giving a customer service class and in other case, facilitation skills, communicating with diplomacy, sometimes stress management, stuff like that. So this is hardcore, very buttoned down corporate. It's very buttoned down and corporate. That's your background? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's where I earned it. Okay. I earned in doing training and consulting. Consulting. So then why are you going so public? I think- Sacrificing, but sure income and a career that you've built for what? 20 years? Yeah, 13, 13. 13 years. And the answer is because I was called to, because I was called very strongly to. So it's a spiritual thing? Thank you for saying it. Absolutely. When I had a certain U-turn, a creative U-turn in the course of writing the show, you see, I had spoken to my mom about my sexuality. It was the first time I ever realized that I had a lot in common with the LGBTQ people, because I was actually coming out to my mom about being kinky. Lesbian, bisexual, transsexual, LGBTQ. Queer. Queer. Basically the gay community. We'll just call it the gay. Transgender. The gay community. Anything other than heterosexual. Yeah, all those folks, I never thought I had anything in common. But can you say the acronym LGBTQ? LGBTQ. Go through that with us. I'll try. Lesbian, bisexual, LBG, is it? Gay. Gay, transsexual, LGBT. And then queer. What is queer? You know what? Some people are identifying as queer and they're not calling themselves gay. Is that like flamboyant? I don't know what that means. I don't know what to say. But somebody just recently said, I'm identifying as queer because he like, I don't know what to say. Okay. I don't know. You can look that up online. We'll figure that out. And guess what? And there's a new acronym too. Somewhere in there is A. Bet you don't know what that is. Sexual. Yeah. Which they call them. Come on, don't I get a prize? You do. I'm going to applaud for you. Thank you. No, I want to be whipped. So they call them- That 30% of you that's- They call themselves aces. And these folks do not have an impulse to be sexual at all. And it's very annoying for them. That's sad. Well, it just is what it is. For me, it would be sad. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure they might feel like they're messing up. We're running, we're getting out of time, Already? But not quite. But I wanted to talk about your mom. You were saying you were talking to your mom. Why'd you feel the need to tell her about this? Because she wanted to know why did I break up with a man I'd taken home for Thanksgiving, whom I loved so much? How long did you know the guy? Oh gosh. We were together for two years. Okay. And you said because? Well, at first I just was- I had vaginismus? My vagina was burning? No, this is since then. Since then, I found a dominant partner who was my lover for almost two years. Oh, I did not know that. You didn't know that. Is he part of your awakening? And you're done with him? Well, the relationship is over. Okay. And now he's married and has a new baby. Oh, okay. So, but you have, you've moved on. But at the time I was very much in love, took him home for Thanksgiving. And then a few months later- Hollywood, Florida? Yeah, I took him home. And a few months later- In a carrier? Was he into S&M too? Is that you? If you're in S&M, you'd bring him in a carrier. You know, like he was the submissive. You'd bring him in like a little animal carrier. Oh, if I may say, he was a dominant. Oh, you, right. You told me that. Okay. He was a D. Okay, great. And nothing but a dominant. Okay. So the point is, is that I broke up with him and my mom who wanted to comfort me, wanted to know why I was being incredibly vague. And finally I just said, mom, I need to tell you a little bit more about the breakup. And some of it had to do with our sexuality wasn't matching up well. In what way? In what way is that I find out that I find that I am a switch. Switch meaning you're both submissive and dominant. Yeah. So- Other things too weren't, you know, quite gelling, but that was a big part. With the submissive in you is the one who likes to be told what to do, who relinquishes control. Yeah. Okay. The dominant is the one who is in control. Yeah. And that's 30%, you would say. Yeah, because what I noticed is I like it at first. I like it after a few sessions or experiences with a partner. And then I kind of want to switch. Oh. Yeah. That's interesting. That makes things more fun, right? It's fun for me if I'm partnering with a switch. And lately I have been. Is it hard to find partners or is there such a world, big vast world in Los Angeles that it's a, the taking is there. If you just look for it, you'll find it. Yes. If you look for it, you'll find it. At least I must say as a female. Men, I think it's a different story. Men have different experiences than I, but yes, I feel like the world is my oyster in this. When you were a child growing up, I know you mentioned that you were sexual and you- You mean like every kid, you know? Right. But you're Jewish? Yeah. Okay. What was going on at home that you think would kind of set up who you are today sexually? Was there anything? Would you said your dad was kind of distant? Well, I would just say- Or does there not have to be anything? It could just be life is what it is. Well, first of all, we certainly didn't talk about sexuality. So we're very much like every other household. Okay. So there's that. And that I believe creates a certain amount of repression for everybody. If you grow up and you're not allowed to talk about the very fascinating thing that's happening to your body. Right. And you can't talk about it, that already creates a weirdness, I believe for every child. That's true. So there's that. So that's okay. Repression was going on there just from not talking about it. And I did get the impression that it wasn't a good idea for me to be in any way overtly sexual. That was not an invited behavior. And nobody ever said anything, but one time I came home with kind of my clothes kind of twisted around when I was a late teen. It was a little repressed. Well, just know I had been playing with somebody, had been heavy petting. Okay. And my clothes were turned around. My mom's like, I don't even want to know. And so there you go. Okay. Well, we are almost out of time, but I told you Jean that I went to the pleasure chest and I told you, I don't know if I mentioned, I did get you a gift. You did say it. Yes. And I tweeted, I don't know if you remember in the tweet, I said, I will bring the cuffs. You did? I wonder what that means. So here's your gift. You can open it up. Okay. Okay. So here's the bag. Yes. And it is from the pleasure chest. Nice gray. It's just a little something. Oh, it's candy cups. That's right. These are just like the necklaces that you would have you when you were a child. Right. And you would, and it says, eat your way out. That's right. They're actual like little candy cuffs. I wanted to get you something that wasn't too overtly sexual. That's right. I'm opening it now. That was just fun. I'm opening it right now. I'm gonna try them on. All right. Okay, so I'm taking- And I'll have to eat you. You'll have to eat your way out. Did you just say you'll have to, what did you say? I did say that. Did you like that? You are, you can put them up for the camera there. We do have this on camera. Thank you. She is, she's in her own element. And the other thing is I bought myself something. What did you get? I'm gonna show you. And that sound you're hearing is me eating candy. Okay, I'm ready to see. Okay, I'm really excited about this. Okay. I consider giving this to you, but it seemed too forward. So I'm like- And you're gonna have to keep it for yourself. I'm like, I'm gonna keep it for me. What is it? Okay, that is a- It is a pinwheel. A Morton's wheel? It's called a pinwheel. They have a more fancy name for it. I'm holding up to the camera. And it's very sensual. Like if the woman is, is blindfolded and naked. Yeah. It has- Or the man. Well, in my case, I'd be, I'd be playing with a woman. And I already have one. So, oh you do? I'm so glad you didn't give it to me. Oh good, okay. So now I have one. And the idea would be that she would be blindfolded or something to that effect and not know where it's gonna go. Correct. And you can- You roll it. It looks like a pizza slicer, cutter. It's round and it has, but instead of it being like one blade, it has little pin type things that are- Right, and so if you do it really lightly, it'll be soft and sensual and interesting. And if you're interested in giving the person more quote, sensation, you would just apply more pressure. Inner thighs are more sensitive- Oh, I know. Than other parts of the body. Believe me, I'm not as innocent as I look, Jean. I might have the innocent questions. Aw. But I'm not that innocent. Now, before we finish up, tell everyone again where they can help you fund your project. Oh, thank you. Kinkyjean.com. Thanks, Ben. K-I-N-K-Y-E-N.com. N-K-Y, that's K-I-N-K-Y-J-E-A-N. And then Jean, like a pair of pants. J-E-A-N. That's right. J-E-A-N.com. A very tight, snug, form-fitting pair of jeans. That's what I'm wearing, actually. Yes, I know, I saw. I checked it out. What do you think I was doing in the 7-Eleven? Oh my God. You were very distracted in there. I was. I find you distracting. Oh my God, I'm blushing. So we wanna thank you, Jean, for being so vulnerable and really opening up. And good luck with everything. Thank you. And the play. Please check it out online. She's got a nice video. It's really professional looking. She talks about what she's gonna be doing on stage. It's a lot of money. I hope you get to it. Thank you. And good luck with everything. And we'll follow up. We'll see how you're doing in a year from now. That would be awesome. Thank you. See what you're doing. It'd be Jean's dungeon. She'll have her own dungeon. But because I know her, I'm gonna get to go in free. Yes, you will. All right, well, thank you all also for joining us. It's so great to have you again. And at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at at